South Australia to put curfew on P-platers

[MercurySilver]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/bre...-1226606348250


FIRST-YEAR P-plate drivers will be banned from driving between midnight and 5am, under a South Australian government proposal.


The drivers also will be banned from carrying more than one passenger aged 16 to 20, although immediate family members are exempt.

Road Safety Minister Michael O'Brien said the proposed changes were aimed at protecting young drivers and their passengers.

"Young people make up five per cent of our population, but account for 12 per cent of fatalities and serious injuries on our roads," Mr O'Brien said in a statement on Tuesday.

"These initiatives, which were shaped by extensive consultation and feedback from the community, are about saving young drivers' lives."

He said young drivers are up to seven times more likely to crash when driving late at night.

And carrying two to three passengers under the age of 21 increases the risk of a young driver crashing by four to five times compared to driving alone.

The passenger restrictions and curfew will not apply if the driver is aged over 25 or if a qualified supervising driver is a passenger.

A bill will be introduced into parliament later this year.



discuss

[Ducati888]

Bloody stupid. Really stupid. Incredibly stupid. Typical band-aid solutions - take away people's rights. In fact I doubt they even have the legal ability to do it.

Why don't they just fix the problem - take L plate training away from parents for a start. I reckon barely 1 in 10 drivers is capable of teaching a young driver what to do, let alone handle the family car.

Train them to drive, train them to know the road rules, train them in the correct use of indicators and round abouts, make a licence something that you truly need to earn, not something that comes from a cereal packet.

Of course, that would be hard. It's far easier to just pass ridiculous legislation and then put the real problem under the rug.

I've said for a long time - there are no competent people in government, or in any government department, at any level. From the cleaners to the ministers, from the police to the rest of the public servants. Barely adequate at best, but far from competent. This is further proof.

[MercurySilver]

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/s...-1226605756161

heres a bigger article than the herald sun one

[Tweaq]

I dont see how this will remedy anything except reduce deaths caused between midnight and 5am...

[MercurySilver]

and too bad if youve scored an afternoon shift job (for the extra money) and knock off at midnight
how about making it compulsory to go thru some decent driver education training and not just lessons and a log book?

apparently this will drop the number of young p platers who have died on our roads in sa

[Ducati888]

The mantra of modern politics, regardless of your camp, is "be seen to be doing something". You don't actually have to do anything. It usually entails very small changes and lots of media and emotion.

[FERG_51]

Originally Posted by MercurySilver

and too bad if youve scored an afternoon shift job (for the extra money) and knock off at midnight
how about making it compulsory to go thru some decent driver education training and not just lessons and a log book?

apparently this will drop the number of young p platers who have died on our roads in sa

Totally agree, compulsory advanced driving course once on P plates.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Ducati888

Bloody stupid. Really stupid. Incredibly stupid. Typical band-aid solutions - take away people's rights. In fact I doubt they even have the legal ability to do it.

Why don't they just fix the problem - take L plate training away from parents for a start. I reckon barely 1 in 10 drivers is capable of teaching a young driver what to do, let alone handle the family car.

Train them to drive, train them to know the road rules, train them in the correct use of indicators and round abouts, make a licence something that you truly need to earn, not something that comes from a cereal packet.

Of course, that would be hard. It's far easier to just pass ridiculous legislation and then put the real problem under the rug.

I've said for a long time - there are no competent people in government, or in any government department, at any level. From the cleaners to the ministers, from the police to the rest of the public servants. Barely adequate at best, but far from competent. This is further proof.

Yes they do have the legal ability, they could even add restrictions to your license that you can only drive pink VL commodores on Thursdays and have to wear a helmet.

That being said, is it actually a good idea?

Well I can see why they want to do it and with the exception of those who require a license during those hours such as shift workers etc. it will not inconvenience anyone except those who are playing up.

On the other hand the driving skill is not the primary source of the problem. It is the selfish attitude and sense of natural entitlement that is now prolific in the generation who are attaining their licenses at the time.
This is what needs to be addressed as they almost all feel they are untouchable and should be given all the rights and entitlements of everyone else without having to earn them.

A simple way to fix this would be to not allow any credit below the age of 21 and from that point until 25 only allow up to 25% of their yearly income with the exception of housing or commercial lending.

All of a sudden it require saving up for the latest phone and designer clothes and most importantly your car.
There will probably be a lot of "I MUST HAVE IT NOW, GIVE IT TO ME, YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO STOP ME DOING ANYTHING" tantrums until they get used to the idea that entitlements are earned not given.

So no, it is just a bandaid that will allow some bureaucrat to move a piece of paper from pile A to pile B, a minister to make a speech and a tool by which SAPOL can remove P platers from the road regardless of whether or not they actually catch them playing up.

[poppa smurf]

minister O'Brien was on the radio this morning talking about this......dispensation will be given, when applied for, to "P" platers who use their motor vehicle between the hours of 12 am and 5 am as transport to and from their job

[Silver Ghia]

Remembering the minimum age for driving licences in SA will remain at 17, whereas in Vic it is 18, I actually think its a good idea.

These days, once the young drivers get their licences they think they are instant experts but unfortunately can easily get into trouble especially if encouraged by their mates in the back seat, which this legislation is aimed at.

Driving is something you keep learning for years, the time you don't learn any more is either when the driving licence is handed in, or when you die. However most skills are learnt not only while on 'L' plates, but also over the 2-3 years after obtaining the licence.

[Ducati888]

Kids are no different now to every other generation. The cars and phones are better, that's about it.

We don't live in communist China. Our laws are by exclusion not inclusion, meaning if it's not explicitly forbidden by Federal and State parliament, in that order, then you can do as you wish.

Whether it's legal or not, my thoughts are that particular groups should not be focussed on and excluded in favour of others. In reality, do you think a driver is more likely to take out a family of school children at midnight - 5am or 5am to midnight? Maybe they should be kept off the road during the daylight when everyone else is on the road. The rest of the time they can be wrapped in bubble wrap and kept in a pink padded room, with soft christian rock playing in the background, and given their food in mushed up drink form so that they don't hurt themselves with sharp cutlery, and unable to do any self harm. All the while, ensuring their over protective parents know exactly where they are.

After all, their parents never did anything risky when they were young, did they?

[EVLKNEVL]

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

Remembering the minimum age for driving licences in SA will remain at 17, whereas in Vic it is 18, I actually think its a good idea.

These days, once the young drivers get their licences they think they are instant experts but unfortunately can easily get into trouble especially if encouraged by their mates in the back seat, which this legislation is aimed at.

Driving is something you keep learning for years, the time you don't learn any more is either when the driving licence is handed in, or when you die. However most skills are learnt not only while on 'L' plates, but also over the 2-3 years after obtaining the licence.

So how will a curfew change any of that?

[Silver Ghia]

Originally Posted by EVLKNEVL

So how will a curfew change any of that?

It 'eases' them into driving with a licence and gaining valuable experience without the supervision that they had before, rather than suddenly being able to drive in the early morning most likely after a full days school or work, which is when they can easily get into grief.

[Kable72]

I think this is stupid and cannot wait to get off my P plates so I can be treated like the other drivers on the road rather than having the "You're a terrible driver" blanket thrown on top of me. Sure, I'm not the best driver out there and the moment you think you're the best or a great driver is when you make a mistake.

[LG17]

Qld has had restrictions for a fair while now.

[Kable72]

At least you're still allowed to drive after midnight though. Just only allowed one passenger.

[buggo]

I don't see how having a law to stop driving after midnight for every P-plater will stop crashes any more than a law saying 'don't do burnouts and race ya mates in ya commy at the industrial park and spill ya Jack Daniels and end up in a tree'. Because, unless I'm mistaken, there is already a law that says that, just not in those words.

This will just inconvenience the good ones like usual, the ones coming home from maccas wash-up at midnight a few hours before school, while the cause of the problem will show this new law just as much respect as the other ones - not much.

[svo supporter]

Every few years the same stuff crops up and every few years nothing comes about it.

How is it going to stop the road toll? Got me buggered...

Isn't it coming up to an election? I reckon that's why it's popped up again

[superpursuit83]

Been this way in WA fora while now on your red P's....

If your a baker etc you can get excemptions for driving out of hours to work etc.

It may even work, home before the night clubs open and not enough mates in the car to show off too when you are driving

Actually I dont care anyway. Had my license 30 yrs

[Franco Cozzo]

Welcome all South Australian P platers to 2007.

We don't have the curfew though, but passenger restrictions.

Lucky its only 3 years, not 4 like us in Victoria.

I've got a 4082kg GMC Sierra which is considered a "high powered vehicle", because of its 6.5L V8 diesel engine (Detroit Diesel V8s hardly count as engines, let alone high performance ones), which I can get an exemption for "work purposes" but not to drive around normally.

Lucky I have less than a year left on P plates, lol.

[xxx000]

I like the idea and think it may go some way to reducing the road toll involving people under 25

Advanced driver courses are not the answer imho, they may even give young drivers a false heightened sense of their own driving skills and abilities

[K93George]

Originally Posted by flappist

It is the selfish attitude and sense of natural entitlement that is now prolific in the generation who are attaining their licenses at the time.
This is what needs to be addressed as they almost all feel they are untouchable and should be given all the rights and entitlements of everyone else without having to earn them.

A simple way to fix this would be to not allow any credit below the age of 21 and from that point until 25 only allow up to 25% of their yearly income with the exception of housing or commercial lending.

All of a sudden it require saving up for the latest phone and designer clothes and most importantly your car.
There will probably be a lot of "I MUST HAVE IT NOW, GIVE IT TO ME, YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO STOP ME DOING ANYTHING" tantrums until they get used to the idea that entitlements are earned not given.

What rights and entitlements do "they" feel they should have like everybody else? I fit into this generation you speak of but I fail to see what rights others have that I don't. A right to drive a V8 TT? That isn't a right! Sure a select few complain that they can't drive a V8 or insurance is too high and they have more restrictions than full licensed drivers but close to all people in the age bracket your referring to that I know have a care factor of 0.

I see absolutely no relation to credit and solving the problem of young inexperienced drivers wrapping themselves around a pole. They wrap themselves around a pole because they are just that, inexperienced. Close to all people in the age bracket I know make mistakes or create dangerous situations because they either don't fully understand the risks of their actions; having almost bold tyres and putting off the purchase of new ones to save some money. Or they are merely inexperienced. They haven't taken this particular bend before in the rain, they take it at the speed limit believing its all good, after all its under the speed limit.

Obviously we have the Learner system to help young drivers gain experience, but as mentioned, if the supervising driver has a limited understanding of the risks involved, what hope does the young driver who already has little to no understanding got?

What people have to understand is, in this age group the individuals are going to have this sense of invincibility, it is just brain development. Do I have a solution to the road toll for young drivers? No, I believe its value is grossly exaggerated, sure deaths are terrible but why not tackle the main leading cause of death for young people in Australia, suicide? Perhaps because the media and public value certain causes of death more then others. Is a death on our road greater then one from obesity, cancer or poverty, perhaps its easier to tackle.

[T-Pak Addict]

I think restricting passengers between certain times is a good idea on P1's. The current "hazard test" they have to do is BS to progress to P2's.... They should be doing an advanced driving course.

Restricting times they can actually drive is nonsense.

[davistev]

This is one area I would like to see as part of the school curriculum. I say this because almost everyone needs a license to get a job and that is one of the mandates of the education system - prepare the youth for the workforce and further education. (Give the student high school credit for getting their drivers license)

I would even go so far and suggest that students who fail to attend school be denied a P plate until they are of school leavers age. If they skip school, then no license. Schools already have to report attendance to the Govt for Centerlink benefits and so thsi would be no biggy.

this would give the youngsters another reason to attend school and it would give schools an opportunity to teach something that is relevant.

[FG50T]

A real joke this is. Basically reduce driving to reduce road fatalities. Just leave the people falling asleep at the wheel and drink drivers driving between 12-5am. They have a right to drive anywhere they want at anytime! They earned their license the same way everyone else did. They either ARE or ARE NOT good enough to drive!

A selfish attitude is not the source of the problem Flappist. If kids are being brought up to be selfish, tantrum throwing cry babies whose fault is that? What are they being taught? Give me a break mate not everyone is like that. 95% of P-platers are regular people who deserve to be able to drive to the servo at 1am or leave to go on a road trip at 4am. Some people under 21 are married but have to rush home before 12 to their mortgaged house because they're not skilled enough to drive at 12.01?

[poppa smurf]

apparently we had 6 deaths total last year in this demographic in South Aus..........4 already this year

not a huge number, statistically, but if any one of us happened to be a parent of just one of these kids it would be a tragedy worthy of any and all knee jerk reactions

any death of a youngster is not acceptable......regardless of your age, to us parents you are, and always will be, our kids

[Ben73]

NSW has had some restrictions between 2300-0500 for a while now for P1 drivers, but an all out ban is stupid.

The stupid ones will still drive like idiots at 2100 and still put themselves around a power pole.

[irish2]

Originally Posted by xxx000

I like the idea and think it may go some way to reducing the road toll involving people under 25

Advanced driver courses are not the answer imho, they may even give young drivers a false heightened sense of their own driving skills and abilities

Silliest post I have ever read. How can increased skill and knowledge in how to maneuver a vehicle result in more deaths? In some European countries the 'Kids' have to do skid pan work before gaining their license. It gives you more knowledge of when a car will let go and how easy it is to stuff up.

When I was a Learner I did a defensive driving course, and an advanced driving one. I have since completed further driver training. It opened my eyes to how easy it was to lose control, and then taught me how to best regain control. At a recent skid pan day there were some dads there paying for their daughters to learn how to control slides and prevent a spin. I was quite surprised, and happy that others thought learning to drive was more than just getting 100 hours in a log book.

[LG17]

Originally Posted by Kable72

At least you're still allowed to drive after midnight though. Just only allowed one passenger.

I think it's 11:00pm till 5:00am

[FGII-XR6]

Originally Posted by Ducati888

Bloody stupid. Really stupid. Incredibly stupid. Typical band-aid solutions - take away people's rights. In fact I doubt they even have the legal ability to do it.

And here we have the number one problem. the belief that a licence is a right not a privilege. no one has an automatic right to an unrestricted licence and level two learners ( learners who are allowed to drive solo or P platers) are expected to put up with some restrictions until the gain experience and some maturity.

P platers driving late at night with a car full of mates are known to be a high risk of accident due to peer pressure they go out cruising and start showing off thinking they are good drivers when they are still learning their driving skills, something goes wrong that an experienced driver may be better equipped to handle and next thing some unfortunate cop has the job of informing 5 parents their son / daughter will not be coming home.

I don't care how many tantrums these kids throw they need to be guided towards gaining skills while staying alive that's worth a bit of inconvenience.

for those crying discrimination , if you have a licence you should be able to drive anytime you want, hear is an alternative solution. raise the licence age to 21 with 4 years of Ls and no night restrictions how would the whinging teens would like that?