Holden local built four cylinder

[Wretched]

http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/s...006301,00.html

Article from: The Advertiser
PAUL GOVER, MELBOURNE/MICHAEL OWEN

November 27, 2008 12:30am

HOLDEN is planning to build its first four-cylinder car since the the 1980s at its Elizabeth plant under a deal worth up to $500 million to secure the company's future in Australia.
The new compact car is likely to be signed off in the next few months and would be built in Adelaide alongside the VE Commodore from 2011 or 2012.

It follows "high-level discussions" with Premier Mike Rann about the long-term future of the South Australian operation.

The new car, which would be about the same size as the Korean-made Holden Viva, is being pitched as a major export earner and could also be produced with a range of body styles, including an SUV.

Early details of the plan have emerged from sources in the U.S. and after discussions between Holden and local unions, although there is no confirmation from the company's Victorian-based Australian headquarters.

[MethodX]

Probably the new version of the Chev Cruze/Viva.
Hope it isnt.

[Powdered Toast Man]

Good for them, more Australian jobs is a good thing no matter the car the engine is for.

[JMO]

Good news for Australian workers and the industry as a whole.

[Fairlane]

Lets pray its a shortened Zeta platform car.

More likely than not it will be a local built Cruze Delta 2 platform FWD car.

[SPK-250]

I cant vision it selling very well, but times may change.

[vanman_75]

as long as it aint a shortened ecocrap like the 80s

[Ghiadude]

im gonna call it camira regardless of the badge lol

[FalconXR6]

"alongside VE Commodore in 2011 / 2012"

You can't tell me that Holden are going to try and wring 6 years out that heap of garbage without an update are you???!!!

[uranium_death]

I am sure that VE will have an update before then, with an improvement in fuel economy being a major focus.

I wonder whether this is merely in response to the plan of Focus being built here.

People will buy it because it's a Holden. Viva is an example, as is Barina.
People don't understand what they're buying apart from the badge.

[Rob's 76 Effy]

Might be a new VE with an update Starfire engine :

Originally Posted by FalconXR6

"alongside VE Commodore in 2011 / 2012"

You can't tell me that Holden are going to try and wring 6 years out that heap of garbage without an update are you???!!!

What's this comment all about. Damn shame this model Commodore has a better designed rear compared to the BA - BG series Falcon. Don't wear tyres out as easy when you lower them. As for the front end, we won't compare them, especially when this is a Ford Forum, not a Commodore one

[irlewy86]

Originally Posted by stickybeek

What's this comment all about. Damn shame this model Commodore has a better designed rear compared to the BA - BG series Falcon. Don't wear tyres out as easy when you lower them. As for the front end, we won't compare them, especially when this is a Ford Forum, not a Commodore one

So what your saying is that the VE is to Falcon what AU was to the Commodore.

I like your thinking

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by uranium_death

I wonder whether this is merely in response to the plan of Focus being built here.

Bingo, I wouldn't be surprised.

Also isn't there a rumour going around that the second shift at Holden is getting canned?

Originally Posted by irlewy86

So what your saying is that the VE is to Falcon what AU was to the Commodore.

I like your thinking

Hey thats harsh, the AU isn't as ugly as the VE!!

[Fordman1]

From what I'm hearing, Holden lose a shift at Elizabeth at the end of Q1 2009, and that rumor is REALLY strong.

They are in strife, and have LOTS of VE's on grass. The G8 at it's current selling rate has about 260 days stock in the US....... YES that is correct !!!

The small car they are looking at assembling, is apparently the 2010 'Cruze'.

http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com...vy-cruze-back/

Looks like a Daewoo to me.

This thing will get slaughtered by the 2011 Focus in dynamics etc, but then again it'll probably sell. I guess time will tell.

[Gobes32]

How long till everyone starts calling it "Torana"?

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

How long till everyone starts calling it "Torana"?

If they're smart they'll 'Pull' that name out again and use it !!

Not sure if they'd use it on a "C" car or save it for a "D".

[vztrt]

No idea, check the just commodore forum. Probably in 3.2 seconds.

[snappy]

In the herald sun today 3/4 quaters of the page is on this .
It starts as holden may build a 4 cylinder motor car
Right down the bottom in a tiny square ford wins car of the year was not a happy snappy.

[Sprint XR8]

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

The small car they are looking at assembling, is apparently the 2010 'Cruze'.

http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com...vy-cruze-back/

Looks like a Daewoo to me.

This thing will get slaughtered by the 2011 Focus in dynamics etc, but then again it'll probably sell. I guess time will tell.

Looks like a Daewoo because it is a Daewoo.
The 2010 Chev Cruze is a rebadged 2009 Daewoo Lacetti.
Chevy Cruze Based Daewoo Lacetti Launches in Korea
http://www.worldcarfans.com/9081107....nches-in-korea

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by coupex

Looks like a Daewoo because it is a Daewoo.
The 2010 Chev Cruze is a rebadged 2009 Daewoo Lacetti.
Chevy Cruze Based Daewoo Lacetti Launches in Korea
http://www.worldcarfans.com/9081107....nches-in-korea

Thanks Coupex.

Mmmmmmm............you've got to wonder.

How can they justify the investment if it already tooled for manufacture in Korea ?

Maybe it's not this car that they are planning on building.................

[burnz]

hasent holden allway's been building the family four and export to korea ??
then fit to deawoo.

[phillyc]

Holden continues with more spin. They don't have the funds to do this. It won't happen.

Holden are the automotive NSW Labor Party. Spin, spin, spin. But it's all bullcrap.

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by phillyc

Holden continues with more spin. They don't have the funds to do this. It won't happen.

Holden are the automotive NSW Labor Party. Spin, spin, spin. But it's all bullcrap.

You know......I think you're right.

They are losing money here, GM in the US is a complete basket case. Where are they going to get the money from ?

The only possibility is govenment funding....A LOT of it from state and federal coffers.

However. if the cars is tooled in Korea, this is a long shot.

FoA's business case is based on exports to all of the Asia / Pacific region. Where will Holden export to if Korea are building it too ?

[DRU842]

Camira tooling is available in Korea.

[Gobes32]

Maybe there is still camira tooling up at elizabeth, anyone fancy a brand new 1990 Camira?

[Nikked]

probally just end up being a epica, with a VE like front and rear...

Originally Posted by irlewy86

So what your saying is that the VE is to Falcon what AU was to the Commodore.

I like your thinking

Na, I'm saying the VE is better designed in the suspension area than the BA - BF, especially when it came to lowering. The AU wasn't that crash hot in the rear suspension design. They tried to copy the Commodore, with the IRS and still failed like the Commodore. The front was worse. :
As for looks. The VE looks better than the AU, but we won't get into that side of things. :

[FGX-351]

Originally Posted by stickybeek

Na, I'm saying the VE is better designed in the suspension area than the BA - BF, especially when it came to lowering. The AU wasn't that crash hot in the rear suspension design. They tried to copy the Commodore, with the IRS and still failed like the Commodore. The front was worse. :
As for looks. The VE looks better than the AU, but we won't get into that side of things. :

Pretty sure it was the irs commodores with the excessive rear camber wear due to missing links in the setup.
Was corrected on vx series 2 iirc.

[Swordsman88]

Originally Posted by stickybeek

Na, I'm saying the VE is better designed in the suspension area than the BA - BF, especially when it came to lowering. The AU wasn't that crash hot in the rear suspension design. They tried to copy the Commodore, with the IRS and still failed like the Commodore. The front was worse. :
As for looks. The VE looks better than the AU, but we won't get into that side of things. :

This is starting to get way off topic but what the hell, that won't stop me.....

I'm not totally sure what you mean here stickybeek (better in what way etc.) but while each has good and bad points, to say a VE suspension is better than a BA-BF is pushing it a bit (not to mention FG has new front end so this is kinda irrelevant now...).

While the VE has several advantages over a BA (front mount steering rack etc.), and a more compact and many would say, more complex multi-link rear suspension, it also has deficincieis. AU-BF falcons have a double wishbone IRS at the front, Commodore uses struts. Most suspension engineers would go for the double wishbone in 99% of circumstances for passenger sedans if they could. Better camber control and ultimately stronger, able to handle more weight etc. The VT-VZ commodore and the VE have struts, albeit the VE is more advanced with a double jointed lower mount.

In the rear suspension, control blade is less compact than the VE IRS (which is a nice designe), but is no worse in most areas. Only measurable difficiency is power down, ride quality is just as good as the commie. In the case of FG, monotube dampers are used all round, which is better than VE twin tube shocks, and the new front suspension trumps the commie by some margin (double wishbone, vitual pivot, double jointed lower arm, front mount variable rack etc.) The Holden front suspension is very close to the current BMW 3 series front end, whereas BMW have announced for the 5-7 series they are using a Vitual Pivot IRS (like Ford) from now on because it is superior.....

Finally, the AU IRS does not have any close resemblance to the Commie VT-VZ IRS. The AU IRS (a very good one at that) while heavy was a pure double wishbone IRS. the VT IRS is a trailing arm design rooted in the 80s, it lacks camber control (hence the tyre wear issues on earlier models etc.) and is far from refined or advanced. In fact in many areas it struggled to best the watt's link in use up to BA.

Suspension design is a dark art in many respects and Holden and Ford are both very good at it. While both sides have had issues RE reliability (AU irs shock mounts, VT tyre wear etc.) i think it is surprising how much we get in our humble aussie cars for what we pay. Anyway, back on topic i suppose......