Whats stopping people from buying the Falcon? - Page 4

Brazen · 07-01-2012, 04:49 PM

Why I didnt buy a Falcon in 2010?

I wanted a practical car which handled great, towed, looked great and preferably Aussie made. As I wanted something practical I was only interested in wagons, immediately Falcon was off the list. I ended up buying a main competitor.

Brazen · 07-01-2012, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naddis01

What stopped us buying a Falcon last year?

We wanted a practical car that my (short) wife could put a pram in easily. Que a wagon. Bye bye Falcon straight away. The BF3 was still for sale then but no thanks. We ended up in a diesel Mazda 6 wagon but considered a Mondeo. The 6 cost more than an XR6 at the time but for us a sedan is just not practical enough. The Mazda 6 has plenty of room for my family and I (I am about 6'3" and 100kg). It drives very well, has as much torque as a Falcon, more features at the time, can fit everything we want to in it, it will have better resale.... The list goes on.

what kind of economy are you getting?

falconnut · 07-01-2012, 05:03 PM

I think its because of stereotypes, brand recognition and populate culture.

From what i have seen, heard and experienced the older Fords are better (EF AU2/3 and BF)

The competitors also offer more for the customers $ as well as a fresher/more hip design and marketing and that famous 'fuel economy' and 'award winning small/medium car' etc...

Franco Cozzo · 07-01-2012, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM83

Yep very true, only me an missus so its no issue (no plans for kids). Trust me i can fit alot into the rear of my Focus.
It suits my needs, i have no need for a bigger car (Id buy an FG ute purely for looks not carrying capacity) as i was originally going to buy.
Same goes for my missus WQ Fiesta we used it as the main tool for moving house (apart from the big stuff) as my car wouldnt have cleared the driveway fully loaded and that this can carry some gear the boot is very deep ie lower so looks are deceiving.

The whole rumour you can't fit shopping in the back of a small car is BS, I've also got an LV Focus and this fit into back with the rear seats folded down:

The roll cab's wheels where just touching the back of the hatch, the top chest was up against the seats.

If I can get that in, with a passenger in the front, how can you not fit shopping in?

naddis01 · 07-01-2012, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brazen

what kind of economy are you getting?

About 6L/100km and diesel is cheaper than petrol out here. Or less than 1/3 of the fuel that my Egas RTV uses.

burnz · 07-01-2012, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brazen

Why I didnt buy a Falcon in 2010?

I wanted a practical car which handled great, towed, looked great and preferably Aussie made. As I wanted something practical I was only interested in wagons, immediately Falcon was off the list. I ended up buying a main competitor.

an australian one i hope..

prydey · 07-01-2012, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Damo

The whole rumour you can't fit shopping in the back of a small car is BS, I've also got an LV Focus and this fit into back with the rear seats folded down:

image

The roll cab's wheels where just touching the back of the hatch, the top chest was up against the seats.

If I can get that in, with a passenger in the front, how can you not fit shopping in?

umm, the argument was regarding room for prams and shopping. if you have the need for a pram, you also have a child and a child seat or 2. folding seats down isn't an option.

however.... its still a false assumption that there isn't enough room.

prydey · 07-01-2012, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burnz

an australian one i hope..

sportwagon - hence his passion for them.

burnz · 07-01-2012, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Damo

The whole rumour you can't fit shopping in the back of a small car is BS, I've also got an LV Focus and this fit into back with the rear seats folded down:

image

The roll cab's wheels where just touching the back of the hatch, the top chest was up against the seats.

If I can get that in, with a passenger in the front, how can you not fit shopping in?

my kind of grocery's..

Franco Cozzo · 07-01-2012, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

umm, the argument was regarding room for prams and shopping. if you have the need for a pram, you also have a child and a child seat or 2. folding seats down isn't an option.

however.... its still a false assumption that there isn't enough room.

Unless you've got one of the big-*** "LOOK AT ME" 4x4 prams, trust me, it'll fit into the boot of a Focus, the only small cars you'll struggle to fit prams in are super mini's like the WS Fiesta.

I see more new Focus/Fiesta out in the small country town I live in over Falcon/Commodore.

I think people are just realising they don't need such a big car anymore. I grew up with two crappy Falcons, XE and an EA, since 99' we got a new WF Festiva, 2003 we got a new 323 and thats for your average 2 parents 2 kids family.

prydey · 07-01-2012, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Unless you've got one of the big-*** "LOOK AT ME" 4x4 prams, trust me, it'll fit into the boot of a Focus, the only small cars you'll struggle to fit prams in are super mini's like the WS Fiesta.

we have a 3 wheeler thing which almost fits in the focus easier than the falcon.... almost.

jixel 78 · 07-01-2012, 05:28 PM

I find my BA Fairmont Ghia terrible for kids/prams/holiday trips. Load up all the gear, stuff on the sport racks,bike rack, two kids,(no dropping the split rear seat) dog, and other stuff all around the mrs feet, not to mention getting littlies out of the rear doors,twisting and bending digging them out of the kid seat. With all that, and its **** is dragging in the dirt, fuel economy shoots up the drainpipe too.No more big Fords for me, and I work for them. I did a little week end away in a work FG. Not much better. I`d have sold it ages ago, but she loves the bloody thing. I`d have a SV6 Sportwagon tomorrow.

dimka100 · 07-01-2012, 05:29 PM

Interesting thread, the thing I noticed it this:

Apart from a few forum members who absolutely refuse to look straight at the facts, just about everyone else said they would/will not buy a new Falcon ... this is not surprising as I too can see very few reasons why one would buy a Falcon and tons of reasons why one would not ...

I would love to support the Australian industry, hell I purchased 4 new locally made cars since I moved to this country, but in this day and age i feel the local industry has become totally irrelevant and out of touch, it seems the only thing that is keeping it afloat are the government grants and strong unions lobbying for job losses ... I think the time has come to adapt or die ...

falconnut · 07-01-2012, 05:34 PM

I agree with you dimka.

Jixel i dont know why you bought a BA Fairmont if you wanted fuel economy, a Wagon would have been much more suitable from the sound of things.

jpd80 · 07-01-2012, 05:37 PM

IMO, a conventional sedan with boot is seen as too restrictive for buyers focused on useful space.
The next gen Falcon needs to skip sedan and become a 5-door hatchback to give more utility.
By doing that, Ford can offer Falcon as a lighter and more efficient alternative to SUVs.

prydey · 07-01-2012, 05:40 PM

financially, i simply can't afford a new car. if i was in a position where i could, i would still buy a falcon. i don't care that there might be other cars that have a bit more kit for the money or slightly cheaper to run etc etc. i like falcons and can't see myself buying anything else.

even when looking at 2nd hand options, i looked at mondeo, territory etc but when i think of my carport without a falcon in it, it just doesn't seem right.

blind loyalty? perhaps, but i'm not buying a car just for the sake of the name. i do actually like the falcon.

i accept that these types of people are a dying breed though. doesn't make me want to run around shouting that the sky is falling. falcon is only on model. plenty more fords on offer.

falconnut · 07-01-2012, 05:41 PM

prydey is right, the economy isnt helping sales

prydey · 07-01-2012, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by falconnut

I agree with you dimka.

Jixel i dont know why you bought a BA Fairmont if you wanted fuel economy, a Wagon would have been much more suitable from the sound of things.

how would that improve fuel economy? it may improve logistics but thats about all.

fg's fuel economy is much improved over ba.

prydey · 07-01-2012, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by falconnut

prydey is right, the economy isnt helping sales

apparently the ave wage now is $68k/yr. i think there are a lot of people on the higher end dragging the average up personally.

for arguments sake, lets say average family man has $1000/wk after tax (thats pretty generous i'd say). take out mortgage, groceries, bills, fuel, etc and it doesn't leave a lot left for savings.

consider that smaller cars like mazda3, focus, cruze, i30 etc are all around $20k brand new and do everything you need a car to do, is it any wonder these cars are flourishing whilst larger sedans are not.

suv's are flourishing as well as they are 'lifestyle' vehicles.

Ford_The_Win · 07-01-2012, 05:50 PM

At the end of the year I will be in a financial position to upgrade to a new car if I want, and I personally will go for another Falcon at this stage. Apart from the positive attributes they offer like longevity and comfort, it's familiarity that would draw me back more than anything else. Better the devil you know (and can fix yourself) than the devil you don't. We have only ever had full sized Australian sedans in the family so that's all I know.

falconnut · 07-01-2012, 05:51 PM

On the topic of Fuel Economy thats probably another reason why new falcons are not selling so well...

prydey · 07-01-2012, 05:57 PM

my FG fully loaded gets high 7's on the highway. can't ask for much more than that.

i get high 9's/low 10's around town too but my ave speed is close to 50km/h due to never in traffic.

its sad that even these types of figures are still considered thirsty.

jpd80 · 07-01-2012, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by falconnut

On the topic of Fuel Economy thats probably another reason why new falcons are not selling so well...

Probably so, 9.9 l/100 km is just not good enough when Holden has two petrol sixes that beat it.
Yes, I know SIDIs aren't flash but Joe Average sees the difference and goes the 8.9 l/100 km Holden,
this is wahy Ecoboost is so terribly important in underscoring just how fuel efficient a local big car can be.

falconnut · 07-01-2012, 06:01 PM

just think of the ecoboost mods.... awesome.

**Elks** · 07-01-2012, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM83

Terry doesnt have sedan dynamics im sorry.

I'd have to disagree with you Dallas. The TT may not chase an F6 down but it would out point ANY 4x4 bar an X5, and steers better than most FWD sedans such as Aurion.

naddis01 · 07-01-2012, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brazen

A graph's Y-axis scale can mask or exaggerate trends. What you need to do is graph a trend-line before Sportwagon release and then a trend line after. You will also need a trend line for the large car segment pre and post Sportwagon release to see how much they converge or diverge.

What you will see is that the Commodore was trending downwards until Sportwagon where the trend then levels out. you will have other factors muddying the water like the fact that the product is ageing which means sales will lessen over time regardless.

Any good at statistical analysis? I forgot how to do it but I have the Excel data set for this graph, which is Commodore sales since 2006.

To me it looks as though Commodore sales have flattened out since 2009.

**Elks** · 07-01-2012, 06:19 PM

I have an FG and love it. I'd prefer sharper more angular (masculine?) styling, but it's a very good car. I use it with my work and plenty of people pile in and out of the thing every day. Everyone expects it to be fast, but the smoothness an ride is what gets them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

IMO, a conventional sedan with boot is seen as too restrictive for buyers focused on useful space.
The next gen Falcon needs to skip sedan and become a 5-door hatchback to give more utility.
By doing that, Ford can offer Falcon as a lighter and more efficient alternative to SUVs.

I'd buy that. GTE spec of course

Mackspower · 07-01-2012, 06:20 PM

(sorry Mods - posted this in the wrong thread earlier today)

I've just made the switch from Falcon to Mondeo Hatch. Price wise I could get the best Mondeo (Titanium) or the G6 Falcon.

From a fuel economy point of view it's 8.5L/100KM (Mondeo) vs 12.8L/100KM (Falcon) - real world based on my own log books. It still have the blue oval on the steering wheel and the Red book position is 66% resale after three years (Mondeo) vs 43% (Falcon).

The two things I miss in the Falcon; the awesome off-the-line urge of the Falcon's sweet six motor and the superior turning circle (the Mondeo is awful here).

Would happily go back to Falcon once they add WAY more equipement levels and fix that resale problem. Owned many Falcons overs thirty years of driving . . . love them dearly.

Falc'man · 07-01-2012, 06:29 PM

No need for an apology Mackspower.

jpd80 · 07-01-2012, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

apparently the ave wage now is $68k/yr. i think there are a lot of people on the higher end dragging the average up personally.

for arguments sake, lets say average family man has $1000/wk after tax (thats pretty generous i'd say). take out mortgage, groceries, bills, fuel, etc and it doesn't leave a lot left for savings.

consider that smaller cars like mazda3, focus, cruze, i30 etc are all around $20k brand new and do everything you need a car to do, is it any wonder these cars are flourishing whilst larger sedans are not.

suv's are flourishing as well as they are 'lifestyle' vehicles.

Respectfully, I don't think affordability is the issue with Commodore and Falcon sales.
the average transaction prices have been stable over the last ten years or so.
I think it has far more to do with your latter point, smaller vehicles increasing in both
size and quality as well as an a la carte choice of vehicles tailor made to buyers needs.

Large cars need to be more attractive to buyers, offering a genuine fuel efficient
alternative to heavy SUVs without the mandatory need for a a diesel option,
a 5-door hatchback increases the chances of attracting those buyers back to Falcon.