SA Premier warns Christmas is Holden deadline

[Jason[98.EL]]

SA Premier warns Christmas is Holden deadline on future of Australian manufacturing

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-09-1...adline/4967202

Originally Posted by ABC

South Australian Premier Jay Weatherill says Holden will stop making cars in Australia from 2016 unless the Federal Government commits by Christmas to more taxpayer support.

Prime Minister Tony Abbott said he did not want the car industry living from hand-to-mouth on subsidies and the Coalition went into the election promising to cut $500 million of car industry assistance.

SA Premier Jay Weatherill is warning that unless the Federal Government commits to a funding boost by Christmas, Holden will announce it is closing down manufacturing in Australia, including at Elizabeth in northern Adelaide.

"They need a commitment as soon as possible. They are making decisions about $1 billion worth of investment in two new models which will secure the future of the plant for another 10 years," he said.

"They need to know that they have a Commonwealth partner and indeed a state partner. We're certainly willing to make our contribution.

"The workforce has made its contribution by agreeing to very substantial wage restraint, so really it is over to the Commonwealth Government to see what contribution they're prepared to make to secure the future of Holden."

Mr Weatherill said Holden's current support runs to 2015.

"Directly it would mean that beyond 2016, like Ford, they would no longer be in Australia," he said.

"That would clearly have knock-on effects to Toyota and indeed the whole component manufacturing supply chain."

Unless there can be some variation in approach from the Coalition then there won't be a future investment by Holden and therefore there won't be a future for Holden so there is obviously a lot of discussion to occur

Mr Weatherill is warning it would see 16,000 jobs lost in South Australia alone, both directly and from suppliers.

Mr Weatherill is waiting on a response to a letter he wrote to Mr Abbott in recent days.

"The new Industry Minister [Ian MacFarlane] has been in communication with my Industry Minister and I do understand he is wanting to visit Adelaide in early October," he said

wow Holden are are holding a big gun at Govco's head

[EDManual]

Holden are ruthless!

[Wretched]

Then so be it, if these companies cannot survive without injection of funds from governments then they're not viable anymore.

Government should direct the funds to other industries.

[mac_man_luke]

Didnt they also say if workers voted yes to their proposal (which they did) that that would mean them staying open? so workers might have given up conditions and redundancy bonuses to still be turfed out by 2016...

[Nikked]

Ford copped alot of flack for haveing the decency to come out and give a pull out date, they are the good guys in this.


Holden have treated workers like pawns, there redundancy entitlements have been reduced and Holden are all but bluntly saying they will leave.

[TC200six]

As others have said, their are other businesses that could do with handouts. I remember an interview last year from someone from the tourism industry who says they can't get anything from the government, yet they throw money at a foreign-owned company. His assumption was that the Holden plant was located in Gillard's electorate, but that isn't true. Her seat was in Melbourne, Holden's plant is in Adelaide.

[Joe5619]

What has Holden done here? NOTHING!! It is the SA state government doing all the talk here. These kind of deals should be done in private and the SA government should shut up until we know what is happening either way!!

Nikked: Holden was very up front when taking to employees about their new wage deal. It was simile, unless the federal government adds more money, they would still close. Everyone involved knew this. The new wage deals only apply if Holden continue to build post 2016.

[stazza]

**** Holden.

I'm not comfortable giving them my precious tax dollars as A) I will never own one and B) I don't care if they cease to exist after 2016. In fact I hope they don't.

They 'slashed' the prices on the VF, but essentially, if they were to get tax payer funding, everyone who buys one is paying more for a Holedung in the end. Besides, they use 50 percent aussie parts, plenty of other real australian businesses that could use the money and benefit to the community.

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by stazza

**** Holden.

I'm not comfortable giving them my precious tax dollars as A) I will never own one and B) I don't care if they cease to exist after 2016. In fact I hope they don't.

They 'slashed' the prices on the VF, but essentially, if they were to get tax payer funding, everyone who buys one is paying more for a Holedung in the end. Besides, they use 50 percent aussie parts, plenty of other real australian businesses that could use the money and benefit to the community.

**** it must be so cool floating in your own little pool of self importance...

[BHDOGS]

Yup it's a joke 50 people from my work got fired recently only thing they got was one days notice and on to new start allowance must be good to be up there making things getting government support big redundancies pay outs and free retraining to other jobs while the rest of the state can get ****** tear down there golden house

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by Wretched

Then so be it, if these companies cannot survive without injection of funds from governments then they're not viable anymore.

Government should direct the funds to other industries.

Ive just had enough hearing about it....fix the business case or submit one that looks semi viable. You cant go on forever saying "please sir, can I have some more".

[nstg8a]

Originally Posted by stazza

**** Holden.

I'm not comfortable giving them my precious tax dollars as A) I will never own one and B) I don't care if they cease to exist after 2016. In fact I hope they don't.

They 'slashed' the prices on the VF, but essentially, if they were to get tax payer funding, everyone who buys one is paying more for a Holedung in the end. Besides, they use 50 percent aussie parts, plenty of other real australian businesses that could use the money and benefit to the community.

Ok, so if they redirect some of that funding to other businesses, will the govt/tax paper get as much of a return on that investment?

If the numbers are even close to being accurate then 15000 unemployed will be a rather massive strain on sa's budget.

We need local manufacturing, fords done, holdens almost there, and Toyota won't be far behind once the these two pick up their toys and bugger off.

Welcome to Australia, the worlds biggest warehouse....

[flooded one]

the only people I feel sorry for are the workers at Holden

[nuthin' fancy]

Originally Posted by Wretched

Then so be it, if these companies cannot survive without injection of funds from governments then they're not viable anymore.

Government should direct the funds to other industries.

In that case, the vehicle assembly industry in Australia has never been viable.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Ford copped alot of flack for haveing the decency to come out and give a pull out date, they are the good guys in this.


Holden have treated workers like pawns, there redundancy entitlements have been reduced and Holden are all but bluntly saying they will leave.

Ford have given a pull out date.

That's interesting because they are denying they have actually confirmed closure, which is stopping us all getting training etc.

I find it hard to see how Fords closure announcement wasn't actually a closure announcement. They may have made the right call by making the decision as soon as they knew, but now to turn around and say it wasn't a closure confirmation just so they can screw over anyone who wants to leave is just wrong. They are no better than Holden.

Both morally bankrupt, greedy US companies. Both are trying to pull out for as little money as possible, by screwing the workers.

And before anyone chimes in with any silly theories that Ford might keep production going in Australia then you are reading too much into it. They are only doing it to stop people who want to leave now, or in the next year or 2, from getting a full closure package.

They wouldn't even listen to a chinese companies plan to buy the rights to manufacture the I6 here, and the factory and machines to go with it. They wanted to use it in light trucks. They don't want anyone using there technology, especially the Chinese. Even if it meant saving hundreds of jobs.

[ILLaViTaR]

The company heads should take the same advice they've given all their unlucky staff over the years and find new work as their position in this country is now unfortunately redundant. No one's interested in their product anymore it's had it's time. That's life, their not viable and their time has come and they're trying to milk it as much as they can. When they should be packing up with what honour they have left instead of guilting the country with heritage ********.

If it's all about the workers shut the company down and put the government handout straight into the workers bank accounts, 275 million divided by a few thousand workers is the package of a lifetime they'd be wrapped.

But they put it into the product instead which ends up sitting unwanted on lots and lots of grass. So What's the point of giving them more money..

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Ford have given a pull out date.

Never said they didn't, re read it :-)

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

They wouldn't even listen to a chinese companies plan to buy the rights to manufacture the I6 here, and the factory and machines to go with it. They wanted to use it in light trucks. They don't want anyone using there technology, especially the Chinese. Even if it meant saving hundreds of jobs.

That's crap, with all the taxpayer money injected to Ford they should have a responsibility to keep as much people as possible in jobs and keep as much manufacturing as possible going. The government should get involved.

[Nikked]

The I6 was/is used in China market Ford Transit...

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Never said they didn't, re read it :-)

Boss's point was that Ford announced pull out date all right but when it comes to the obligations that brings, they're ignoring it...

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Boss's point was that Ford announced pull out date all right but when it comes to the obligations that brings, they're ignoring it...

Could it be they are waiting for the final falcon before starting shut down procedures?

[FalconXV]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

They wouldn't even listen to a chinese companies plan to buy the rights to manufacture the I6 here, and the factory and machines to go with it. They wanted to use it in light trucks. They don't want anyone using there technology, especially the Chinese. Even if it meant saving hundreds of jobs.

Scandalous! Do you know which company, Boss? I hope they engage in some good ol Chinese IP theft so grandpas axe can live on. Real shame they don't want the community to thrive after they leave a smouldering crater. This has tarnished my view of Ford somewhat.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by stazza

**** Holden.

I'm not comfortable giving them my precious tax dollars as A) I will never own one and B) I don't care if they cease to exist after 2016. In fact I hope they don't.

They 'slashed' the prices on the VF, but essentially, if they were to get tax payer funding, everyone who buys one is paying more for a Holedung in the end. Besides, they use 50 percent aussie parts, plenty of other real australian businesses that could use the money and benefit to the community.

And while they are at it they should do away with negative gearing!

Its a blight on our tax revenue system and I don't like it because

A, I will never own an investment property to gain from it.

B, I don't care if rents go up or investors go broke.

.............

[nstg8a]

First thing to happen if a Chinese company bought the rights and tooling for the barra would be it all gets shipped to china.... Would be zero gain for the community.

[wrongwaynorris]

Iv'e gor news for you all , even if Holden get this they will still shutdown production in 2016 .

[pottery beige]

much as much.. export or die..

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/busine...-1226723030982

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by pottery beige

much as much.. export or die..

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/busine...-1226723030982

There may be one roadblock to negotiations, however. Mr Macfarlane has demanded Holden export cars in significant numbers - even if it is unprofitable - because domestic demand is not enough to support local production.

You just gotta love logic like that. I reckon its not a matter of increasing exports by thousands, or even ten of thousands, but Holden would have to get exports over a 100,000 a year to be able to justify a car assembly plant (after all Toyota export alot more cars than Holden, and still lose money on their exports). Its all just a matter of everyone saying the right thing to keep the media and public on side, and trying to screw the other party in private talks. The more cars Holden exports (up to a certain point), the more money they lose, the more they ask for assistance. Not a great business plan that would see all parties sign off on it.

[GT0336]

Originally Posted by Brazen

That's crap, with all the taxpayer money injected to Ford they should have a responsibility to keep as much people as possible in jobs and keep as much manufacturing as possible going. The government should get involved.

We might not like it, but its their company and their technology. They have every right to choose if they do or do not want to sell it. There is absolutely no place for the government to include themselves in the decision.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by bobthebilda

You just gotta love logic like that. I reckon its not a matter of increasing exports by thousands, or even ten of thousands, but Holden would have to get exports over a 100,000 a year to be able to justify a car assembly plant (after all Toyota export alot more cars than Holden, and still lose money on their exports). Its all just a matter of everyone saying the right thing to keep the media and public on side, and trying to screw the other party in private talks. The more cars Holden exports (up to a certain point), the more money they lose, the more they ask for assistance. Not a great business plan that would see all parties sign off on it.

Why are 100,000 exports necessary?
That only applies if the vehicles you are selling have a lowish profit margin.
On David Butner's figures a few years back the income derived from Camry
exports versus the numbers given worked out to $17,000 a car..

Now if Holden manages to get say, $30,000 a car exported, there's a good chance that smaller
incremental product may be all that's needed to sustain local production for the next five or so years.

The remaining argument is the same as Ford's, that the sales volume does not justify a unique regional platform.
If Holden is to survive, that means going back to a future global car but mys sources tell em Alpha is way too expensive
and in any regard, the yanks are jealously guarding any engineering development work for themselves.

[bobthebilda]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Why are 100,000 exports necessary?
That only applies if the vehicles you are selling have a lowish profit margin.
Now if Holden manages to get say, $30,000 a car exported, there's a good chance that smaller
incremental product may be all that's needed to sustain local production for the next five or so years.
The remaining argument is the same as Ford's, that the sales volume does not justify a unique regional platform.
If Holden is to survive, that means going back to a future global car but mys sources tell em Alpha is way too expensive
and in any regard, the yanks are jealously guarding any engineering development work for themselves.

Holden would love to be exporting cars at a lowish profit margin. The problem is, that at the moment, they dont even make a lowish profit on any car made in Australia,( be it sold locally or exported). In order to get a lowish profit for each export, they would need to increase prices, and an increase in price tends to soften sales. There is only a slight "niche" factor about a commodore and none in an Australian cruze, so they can only compete on production scales. Once they go to "world" cars, post commodore, how can they even think of exporting, apart from to New Zealand.