Why no AWD drive XR6T. Why no LPG Territory?

GTP-03 · 13-07-2009, 11:50 PM

Why dont Ford make whats available on one model, available on a model which is similar in DNA and vice versa. Turbo AWD is available on Territory and has been for some time, which is awesome, but why cant it be done to the Falcon XR6? How good would it be to have 6 cylinder AWD turbos on LPG across the Falcon/Territory range? Power, grip and economy on a choice of 2 platforms! This is what Ford should be working on yesterday in my opinion, I know I would love an AWD 6 cyl 6 speed LPG Falcon!

naddis01 · 13-07-2009, 11:52 PM

Why no AWD XR6T? Apart from cost, Weight!

Road_Warrior · 13-07-2009, 11:56 PM

No one would buy them dude. An AWD XR6T would weigh as much and gobble as much fuel as a turbo Territory with nowhere near the level of flexibility. The only practical application it would have would be a hi-po use which Holden have already tried and failed. No one would buy them. Not to mention there are packaging reasons with the AWD system more than likely being incompatible with the Falcon floorpan out of the box.

GK · 14-07-2009, 12:02 AM

Remember the Magna AWD?

I've only seen a few on the road, they're as rare as hen's teeth.

Went down like the Titanic really.

GK

Linkachu · 14-07-2009, 12:16 AM

No one would but it, there is a reason people buy these RWD cars... Well its just alot of fun :P

PoweredByCNG · 14-07-2009, 12:19 AM

I can see a huge market for an LPG Terri though!

Regards,
Dave

Iggypoppin' · 14-07-2009, 01:09 AM

Reminds me of nissan GTR. They made that work somehow, but that's a little different.

vztrt · 14-07-2009, 01:57 AM

Ford did look at the AWD system for the FG, but it obviously never looked like it would sell.

Terri e-Gas is due to fitment problems as the petrol tank is very different to a normal car. I'm 100% if they could have done it easy they would have released it.

jonk · 14-07-2009, 02:08 AM

It was because a diff at the front wouldn't fit reliably. One of the struts, think LHS has a 'bow' like the terri for the pass through into the housing ?

You'd have to get one of the terri forum bloke's to answer for sure, they'd know.

Foylema · 14-07-2009, 02:15 AM

Yep i want to see a LPG territory!!

platinumXR · 14-07-2009, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GK

Remember the Magna AWD?

I've only seen a few on the road, they're as rare as hen's teeth.

Went down like the Titanic really.

GK

I got to drive a couple of different ones as work cars intermittently and was pretty unimpressed as they are just too heavy. The V6 was a torquey engine but ran out of puff very quickly. Average amounts of grip in wet or dry but the tyres are not exactly my choice of boots...and the brakes are very ordinary.

It would be nice to own an F6 AWD...in Lightning Strike...with 20" BBS CH...

greenfoam · 14-07-2009, 07:43 AM

The Falcon is so soooo overweight even as a 2WD another 150? kgs would be a disaster. You can not even imagine how they feel to drive if you aren't used to it, but the handling of an oil tanker usually comes to mind :S

chevypower · 14-07-2009, 08:22 AM

Everyone thought they wanted a LS1 Holden AWD at one point, until the Adventra came out with crap performance, and used over15L per 100km. My Silverado V8 doesn't use that because i can switch it in to 2wd, even though it's bigger, heavier, less aerodynamic. Part time 4x4 is my preference.

ltd · 14-07-2009, 09:26 AM

Cost and lack of performance on both counts.

flappist · 14-07-2009, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoweredByCNG

I can see a huge market for an LPG Terri though!

Regards,
Dave

Yeh but you can see a huge market for a LPG jumbo jet, a LPG motorcycle, a LPG semi trailer, a LPG laptop, a LPG mobile phone, a LPG hamburger, a LPG elephant.............

4Vman · 14-07-2009, 09:46 AM

Coupe 8 anyone..?

**Raptor** · 14-07-2009, 10:07 AM

Why no AWD XR6T;

too heavy
too cumbersome
too tall, the Terri AWD system is designed to also lift the frame of the car

Why no LPG Terri;

tank location problematic (market still wants a full size spare too, solving this erodes the other Terri attributes of space/versatility/user freindliness)
range of existing (eGas) system is not sufficient (Terri is thirstier than Falcon)
erodes the business case for the diesel powertrain which has been on-again, off-again far too many times.

Crazed · 14-07-2009, 10:08 AM

An LPG Territory would sell it socks off as it would easliy dominate the SUV fleet market. It could also hit the spot with a lot of mums and dads. It gives it a point of difference from other SUVs, and in such a competitive market any point of difference is good.

Speaking of the AWD Magna, I want to get one, one day as a cheap farm bush basher. Its AWD system is apparantly amazing with more traction than many off road AWDs, it even has a rear limited slip diff.

merlin · 14-07-2009, 10:09 AM

It's so much fun in RWD though why spoil it by adding weight and taking away oversteer - its a muscle car (loose definition) not a track warrior. As for LPG Terry the diesal is due soon.

vztrt · 14-07-2009, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

Yeh but you can see a huge market for a LPG jumbo jet, a LPG motorcycle, a LPG semi trailer, a LPG laptop, a LPG mobile phone, a LPG hamburger, a LPG elephant.............

Ghiadude · 14-07-2009, 10:14 AM

Out of interest how much does a turbo terri weigh and how much does a phoon weigh?
how much of the difference is AWD and how much is the extra steel for the body??????

shakows · 14-07-2009, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazed

Speaking of the AWD Magna, I want to get one, one day as a cheap farm bush basher. Its AWD system is apparantly amazing with more traction than many off road AWDs, it even has a rear limited slip diff.

My last car was an AWD Magna, fantasic car, awesome handling, just little lacking in the power department

Main reason we changed to the TT was for the extra boot space, and the 7 seats and of course the POWER!

I ended up selling it to my 23 year old brother with 75,000 on the clock for a measly $10K

platinumXR · 14-07-2009, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tx3dude

Out of interest how much does a turbo terri weigh and how much does a phoon weigh?
how much of the difference is AWD and how much is the extra steel for the body??????

I guess to make it (AWD Falcon) a viable engineering product it would need to be designed from the ground up specifically as an AWD Falcon rather than using something like an Territory floor fan because it would simply weigh just shy of a Chieftain Tank...so comparing weights would be kinda moot I think.

Subaru's for example are designed from the word go as an AWD rather than 'mating' (read - butchering) an AWD into it.

The Coupe 8 was an example of this (not exactly a good analogy, as it was designed to be AWD so steady with the flame thrower) but the AWD system needed to be more robust to cope with the V8 (as opposed to a 4 cyl Boxer for example) so it was engineered to cope and as a result was too heavy to be of any spectacular or useful significance. Probably the LEAST of it's flaws but the most relevant here.

If some metallurgist tomorrow created some wonderful new unobtanium made of diamonds and fairy dust that could be wafer thin, weigh a bit less than a kitchen cappuccino machine and yet handle the torsional demands of an aircraft carrier engine or the Space Shuttle; then I think there might be hope for an AWD Turbo Falcon by the year 3075...maybe...much to my disappointment too by the way.

I remember buying and reading the Motor Magazine with the Ferguson AWD XF Falcon and I was VERY exited and started saving money to buy a future generation...

EDManual · 14-07-2009, 11:12 AM

I must say those awd magnas are a wolf in sheeps clothing down dirt roads!!

They have a fantastic lsd on the back which gets you nice and sideways and yet has the grip of the fronts spinning too to pull you through the corners.

Road_Warrior · 14-07-2009, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonk

It was because a diff at the front wouldn't fit reliably. One of the struts, think LHS has a 'bow' like the terri for the pass through into the housing ?

You'd have to get one of the terri forum bloke's to answer for sure, they'd know.

I guess there is a reason why the aftermarket or backyard tinkerers have not been able to do an AWD conversion to a Falcon using the Territory front end.

4Vman · 14-07-2009, 11:19 AM

has anyone checked the fuel usage sticker on a Turbo Terri for city driving??? 20l/100 k's...

Mr Hardware · 14-07-2009, 11:22 AM

mmm LPG Hamburger mmmmmmm

merlin · 14-07-2009, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

has anyone checked the fuel usage sticker on a Turbo Terri for city driving??? 20l/100 k's...

I was actually going to buy one (so was a mate) until we made this "small" discovery...

Matty4 · 14-07-2009, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

has anyone checked the fuel usage sticker on a Turbo Terri for city driving??? 20l/100 k's...

Pfffttt....where'd you dream that figure up from???
Ours is used mainly around town and it currently sits on 15-16l/100.
Out on the highway it's down into the 12-13l/100 range.
The published combined figure is 14.2l/100 BTW..

vztrt · 14-07-2009, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matty4

Pfffttt....where'd you dream that figure up from???
Ours is used mainly around town and it currently sits on 15-16l/100.
Out on the highway it's down into the 12-13l/100 range.
The published combined figure is 14.2l/100 BTW..

They have to publish the city figure and the highway figure as well as the combined figure. So:

Quote:

Fuel Urban (l/100km)20.5
Fuel Extra Urban (l/100km)10.6
Fuel Combined (l/100km)14.2