Covid 19 -

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Romulus

If it's compulsory I absolutely won't download it.
If it's not compulsory, I choose not to download it.

I'm with you, I'm not going to use it.

Yes, private companies collect data on us but the only time police and government have access to this information is through a warrant.

I'm not too interested in making it easier for the government to track my movements and who I meet without having to go through court to get the data.

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I'm with you, I'm not going to use it.

Yes, private companies collect data on us but the only time police and government have access to this information is through a warrant.

I'm not too interested in making it easier for the government to track my movements and who I meet without having to go through court to get the data.

That's it, why serve it to them on a platter. I have nothing to hide, but it's the principle.

The 'just a little bit more' is a bad ideology but most of society seems to be ok with it.
"They already have X information, a little bit extra won't hurt"
Few months later "Oh well they already have that extra information, a little bit more isn't a big deal"
Few months later "A little bit more is ok by me"



If you want to use it, go ahead. It has benefits no doubt. I'm not going to say anything bad about people who want to use the app. I see that courtesy will not be returned based off a few comments on the last page.

[nuthin' fancy]

Originally Posted by falcon_bandit

This dude needs to run for president
https://youtu.be/GLcNStHTDjM


WARNING: This clip is not family friendly with plenty of swearing and inappropriate language.

I watched that then had to clean my glasses.

[T3rminator]

This is brilliant. It is not supposed to be open source due to security concerns, but they have already managed to decompile it. My favourite bit "I'm glad this isn't like the indian government one I recently took a look at."


https://twitter.com/xssfox/status/1254258634902499328

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Romulus

I'll correct you as you're wrong. The job keeper allowance (subject to eligibility) subsides an employees wage should the employer decide to keep the worker. If you were on $1k per week, but I couldnt afford to keep you on anymore I'd offer you the $750 per week or the door. It'd be your choice to take the $750 ( and perhaps reduced hours or a change in roster) or to walk.........

If the original 1k was the award rate for 38hrs ie. $26.32/hr you'd have no choice other than to reduce hours if you reduced it to $750.
So it wouldn't be a pay cut, it would be a move to a reduced 28.5hrs and permanent part time conditions with sick and holiday pay.

Interestingly, for people receiving more than their original wage, employer super contribution is only required on the original rate, not on the full $750.

[buggerlugs]

30 to 40 year old's suffering strokes...........

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...oung-patients/

[PhilT2]

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

30 to 40 year old's suffering strokes...........

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...oung-patients/

I wonder, if one of these stroke victims were to die , how would the cause of death be recorded, stroke or virus?

Link has a comparison of covid and swine flu, not the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnQc...ature=youtu.be

[Citroënbender]

First CV death of a person known to me, albeit overseas (US East Coast). Father of a close friend. Eighty and bedridden after a recent fall, having suffered dementia for some years. Predominantly recent Spanish ancestry, interesting in light of how Spain has fared.

[Cav]

I watched an interview with some Swedish bloke who seemed to know what he was talking about.

His assessment?

The toll is double the normal flu

[russellw]

Originally Posted by superyob

So if someone has a serious but non fatal gunshot wound which gets a toxic infection and that person dies, what is the cause of death???

I think you are starting to troll.

It will depend on the period of time that has elapsed between the wound and the death which is no different to (for example) the road fatality statistics where a road accident fatality is only recorded if death occurs within 30 days of the accident.

Statistical data isn't actually designed to establish root cause. There is an internationally recognised standard coding set (ICD-10) that we use a slightly modified form of in Australia which allows for multiple causes of death to be recorded where appropriate and sets the definitions as to causal periods.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by PhilT2

I wonder, if one of these stroke victims were to die , how would the cause of death be recorded, stroke or virus?

Most hospital administrators would probably write it down as a covid death.

[cs123]

I downloaded the app.

Only information that was verified was the phone number and it did that by way of a SMS PIN to confirm activation

Name: Put anything you want there
Postcode: put anything you want there.

As far as AWS being used for storage of data. AWS infrastructure is IRAP compliant.

What do you give up using the application? Your phone number and a history of proximity to other phones running the app

What do you gain by using the app? The health departments are able to quickly notify people who may be at risk, thus limiting the spread of the virus and enabling us to get our lives back to some normalcy sooner.

[russellw]

Australia recorded 14 new cases yesterday and 3 deaths so the CMR increased to 1.237%. WA, SA, NT and ACT all recorded none but Queensland recorded 3 so the easing of restrictions planned for next weekend might be a little early.

NZ had 9 new cases but no deaths so the CMR drops to 1.224%.
The UK also improved CMR to 13.565% while the US worsened slightly to 5.648%.

Globally we will surpass 3M cases some time today.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by russellw

I'm not convinced that the WA / QLD lifting of some restrictions is actually a good idea

The problem is we can't live in a bubble for ever. Given that a vaccine that will allegedly save the world is still 12-18 months away the only way we'll be able to manage the spread of CV19 is through herd immunity, a slow but steady spread through the community until the virus fizzles out.

Given there a multiple drug treatments available that have been proven effective as soon as a diagnosis of cv19 is detected it should be manageable. The only caveat being the TGA refusing to allow the use of off label drugs.

This chap is having great success dealing with patients with CV19
https://twitter.com/zev_dr

Video interview with Dr Zelenko and his treatment strategy.

https://www.pscp.tv/AVoiceNews/1PlKQmLblwMKE?t=6m55s

[Tassie f100]

Our Tasmanian numbers are maybe a bit distorted because all of our recent active cases are concentrated around the Burnie area where cases can be linked back to the cruise ship.The remainining 95% of the state population really aren’t effected.I may be wrong but,pretty sure there haven’t been any active cases detected outside that 100sq km area.

[PhilT2]

Originally Posted by cs123

I downloaded the app.

Only information that was verified was the phone number and it did that by way of a SMS PIN to confirm activation

Name: Put anything you want there
Postcode: put anything you want there.

As far as AWS being used for storage of data. AWS infrastructure is IRAP compliant.

What do you give up using the application? Your phone number and a history of proximity to other phones running the app

What do you gain by using the app? The health departments are able to quickly notify people who may be at risk, thus limiting the spread of the virus and enabling us to get our lives back to some normalcy sooner.

What! No sign of govt tracking and monitoring; no inbuilt mind control. That's disappointing. For a moment there I thought that the govt might have actually cared about me. The sad truth, which I've always suspected, is that they don't give a rat's....

[cs123]

Originally Posted by PhilT2

What! No sign of govt tracking and monitoring; no inbuilt mind control. That's disappointing. For a moment there I thought that the govt might have actually cared about me. The sad truth, which I've always suspected, is that they don't give a rat's....

A bit disappointing really. Judging by the frothy mouthed response by people I was expecting so much more.

What really cracks me up is the sudden concern people have... the same people who freely give away all their location data and personal data to private companies....

[russellw]

Originally Posted by Romulus

The problem is we can't live in a bubble for ever. Given that a vaccine that will allegedly save the world is still 12-18 months away the only way we'll be able to manage the spread of CV19 is through herd immunity, a slow but steady spread through the community until the virus fizzles out.

Sorry but there is not yet a clinically proven viable treatment despite your links to other fringe loonies and it's probably not going to fizzle out any more than Influenza has - nice as that would be.

As to living in a bubble, maybe that will actually form part of the new order in the mid-term. Nearly all of Oceania is made up of islands that share no land borders with any other country so perhaps the bubble encompasses that region only - once the new case rates reach whatever level is deemed 'safe' (albeit safe being a relative term).

As we've seen from the Burnie (Tas) and NSW aged care facility outbreaks, the infection rate can be both rapid and high so even if we reach a zero new case state, it will be essential to avoid importing new cases.

The daily new case rates are improving in most places - I've taken the usual 3 graphs and shortened their time frame to 14 days for a better look at what is trending:

AU / NZ have not shown the continued downturn I'd have expected with a slightly upward trend the last few days.



UK/ Spain / Germany / Italy - at least the UK and Spain are heading in the right direction while Germany isn't improving fast enough and Italy is heading the wrong way.



The USA shows a downward trend over the last couple of days but we will have to wait another couple of days to see if that's just the weekend testing impact or a real gain.

[russellw]

It's also worth noting that the NT has now had 20 days without a new case and SA has had 4. The latter isn't enough given the ACT had 6 straight days in mid-April before another case and then 3 straight days last week before another case.

It actually begs the question what that number should be. It's not a question on the mind of too many countries yet when that are mostly still recording hundreds and even thousands of new cases a day so we are (AU/NZ) likely to be a bit of a litmus test for the rest of the world.

In my mind, it would be no new cases for at least one full incubation cycle but then whose incubation period do you use? The WHO says it's 10-14 days; the US CDC says 14-28 days while Australia seems to have no agreed idea as to what it is.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by russellw

Sorry but there is not yet a clinically proven viable treatment despite your links to other fringe loonies and it's probably not going to fizzle out any more than Influenza has - nice as that would be.

Will look forward to your retraction and apology when you’re proven wrong.

[X-AHH]

Just MHO, so don't jump on me from a dizzy height!
It will be interesting to see if the seasonal flu is mitigated due to the social distancing and increased hand hygiene this year. The biggest problem with combating covid seems to be that the symptoms can be quite mild in many infected people which makes it harder to isolate and from initial studies, it looks like any immunity following infection is transient and minimal which makes a vaccine that much harder to effectively produce. At least with the flu there have been years of study and research to guide the vaccine process which is why it is semi effective now. Covid vaccine is likely to be 12 or even 48 months away until it is refined enough to have a significant long term effect (I reckon).

[CoupeKing]

I'm a little sceptical of a vaccine pushed by a guy that has stated numerous times that our planets population needs to decrease.

Designs computer software
creates a virus
Makes even more money selling Anti-virus
Repeat with humans

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by cs123

A bit disappointing really. Judging by the frothy mouthed response by people I was expecting so much more.

What really cracks me up is the sudden concern people have... the same people who freely give away all their location data and personal data to private companies....

Said personal data collected by private companies is only accessable to government via warrant handed down by courts when you're on the law enforcement ****list.

It's not freely handed out to the Government, Amazon probably isn't going to send law enforcement after you if you criticize their service or expose something like Governments have a tendency to do if you don't toe the line.

I'm not concerned about my own day to day life, I'm concerned about the precedent of allowing the government to collect data on its own citizens because things can change in 5, 10, 20 years and not always for the better.

AFP already has a habit of raiding the media every time something inconvenient for the government surfaces and as such our democracy has dropped from open democracy to narrowed:

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/the-feed...en-to-narrowed

[prydey]

Originally Posted by xahh

Just MHO, so don't jump on me from a dizzy height!
It will be interesting to see if the seasonal flu is mitigated due to the social distancing and increased hand hygiene this year.

I think there is a good chance seasonal flu will also be reduced by the current restrictions. Transmission is essentially the same so by practicing good hygiene and not congregating in large numbers it should have an effect. How big will depend how long current restrictions go for.

While the events of other countries should serve as a warning not to be complacent I think that easing restrictions needs to happen sooner rather than later. Even if it's just region by region. SA is now 4 days without a reported case.

Lower populated states and territories (nt, tas, act and sa etc) are all tracking pretty well.

[Cav]

Originally Posted by Romulus

Will look forward to your retraction and apology when you’re proven wrong.

Perhaps using a time limit of ...?

[PhilT2]

Originally Posted by Cav

Perhaps using a time limit of ...?

And putting money where your mouth is...

[LG17]

Two interesting articles about kids and the virus.
It appears the early notion that kids don't get it is falling apart.



https://blog.crushthecurve.today/chi...IDYZWFC6W2_N8w




https://www.weteachwell.com/pm-gasli...bXYNmWKzj3R_Tk

[russellw]

Originally Posted by Romulus

Will look forward to your retraction and apology when you’re proven wrong

Don't hold your breath on that one. If one of those alleged cures ends up being clinically proven as efficacious (to a reasonable standard) by a reputable body, then I'll be happy but I'm not going to apologise for doubting the opinion of a couple of loonies with a social media presence.

It would be more beneficial to consider at what level we would be prepared to accept a treatment as effective enough. Do we use the Influenza level of 99.9% recovery as a benchmark or do we accept some lower level?

Already, influenza is deadlier to:

- children < 5, especially those younger than age 2;
- adults > 65;
- residents of nursing homes;
- pregnant women;
- people with weakened immune systems;
- people who have chronic illnesses, such as asthma, heart disease, kidney disease, liver disease or diabetes; and
- people with a BMI >40

... much of which it shares with COVID19. In the USA alone, it results in 200k hospitalisations each year and around 6-9k deaths although some years have been much worse. None-the-less that's still less than 2 deaths per 100k people (on average) where the USA COVID19 rate is over 26 per 100k.

It's a little different here in Australia with a 0.488 mortality rate per 100k for COVID19 so that might influence the level we end up accepting.

[guzzis3]

Russelw in post #2239 you seem to have posted the same graph twice of nsw/vic and missed the data for the smaller infection states.

I'm not downloading the app because:

1. It probably won't run on my phone
2. I often forget my phone when I leave the house
3. 15 minutes near a person ? FFS I never did that before the damn lockdown.

If the government were wanting to track me I make it harder than most, but the real danger would be to the person assigned to track me. Real danger of dying of boredom...

[Cav]

Originally Posted by guzzis3

Russelw in post #2239 you seem to have posted the same graph twice of nsw/vic and missed the data for the smaller infection states.

I'm not downloading the app because:

1. It probably won't run on my phone
2. I often forget my phone when I leave the house
3. 15 minutes near a person ? FFS I never did that before the damn lockdown.

If the government were wanting to track me I make it harder than most, but the real danger would be to the person assigned to track me. Real danger of dying of boredom...

What a silly boy you are.

The app is to be used to contact people who have come into close contact with someone who has tested positive for Covid Virus. The info is retained for 3 weeks.

If you would rather not know then that's your call.

What exactly do you think the govmint can do with your info that Google can't already do?