Car industry prepares for Ford Australia exit - Page 7

imugli · 01-08-2012, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Bingo.

Why we cant have a local CEO is beyond me, there are some very very good people in the chain locally.

Because every time they put an Aussie in the chair, they end up turning the place around and they have to send a Yank over to send it down the tube again...

tranquilized · 01-08-2012, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Bingo.

Why we cant have a local CEO is beyond me, there are some very very good people in the chain locally. We get treated like some outpost that is good for some experience, a little holiday or assignment.

In saying that I can see the attraction for a local to move OS within the ranks aswell, you would be mad not to.

A local guy/gal would have far more passion and more to lose than a fly-by-nighter.

Everything that has happened to FoA is a product of changing management trying to stamp their own signature on what occurs here. No continuity whatsoever. Look at the delay with the TDi Tez for example.

Well its quite obvious really.

Bob Graziano has been sent here to wrap up the Falcon, and probably manufacturing operations as well. No more, no less.

He seems to be on track as well. A local CEO just wouldn't be as willing or effective in getting this job done...

barra240t · 01-08-2012, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Resurrection

Are you able to extend the list prior to 1995?

I think this right:

Jacques Nasser- 1989-1992
John Ogden- 1992-1995
David Morgan- 1995-1999
Geoff Polities- 1999-2004
Tom Gorman- 2004-2008
Bill Osborne- 2008-2008
Marin Burela- 2008-2010
Bob Graziano- 2010-present

barra240t · 01-08-2012, 06:02 PM

One more and I am out:

Bill Dix- 1985?-1989
Jacques Nasser- 1989-1992
John Ogden- 1992-1995
David Morgan- 1995-1999
Geoff Polities- 1999-2004
Tom Gorman- 2004-2008
Bill Osborne- 2008-2008
Marin Burela- 2008-2010
Bob Graziano- 2010-present

Dr Smith · 01-08-2012, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RASER

At least the Lion King brand has a robust export program, something that FoA overlooked at its peril.

In less than 10 years time [how long will The General hang on for?], the mighty BigT[tm.F.0] wins, last manufacturer standing, and the one who has had by and away the best quality of any car manufactured here

The Camry Hybrids nice, the rest of the range does nothing for me

What is the robust export plan? 5000 cars maybe to the US as VF is not mentioned as going anywhere else, while Caprice cop car is selling up a storm.....not.

Dusty1 · 01-08-2012, 07:39 PM

Might have been answered previously, but will Ford opt for a middle ground and bring in vehicles as knocked down for assembly here?

I reckon the Taurus would be a goer, so is the Expolorer. But in righT hand drive might take some working. I hope whatever happens, we are still able to option up a large car, I've got three in child seats for at least the next seven years, and really don't want to go to a people carrier.

barra240t · 01-08-2012, 08:08 PM

I would absolutely love to see Ranger built here, the country that helped create the T6 in the first place. We have a big enough market here to supply our own country without exporting it. I know, I know, its costs money, but to be honest I don't see Thailand ever supplying enough for the demand Australia has for this model.

Bossxr8 · 01-08-2012, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

What is the robust export plan? 5000 cars maybe to the US as VF is not mentioned as going anywhere else, while Caprice cop car is selling up a storm.....not.

Exactly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dusty1

Might have been answered previously, but will Ford opt for a middle ground and bring in vehicles as knocked down for assembly here?

I reckon the Taurus would be a goer, so is the Expolorer. But in righT hand drive might take some working. I hope whatever happens, we are still able to option up a large car, I've got three in child seats for at least the next seven years, and really don't want to go to a people carrier.

They wouldn't do CKD. When you have a complete press shop here to do all the panels you wouldn't bother. It wouldn't be expensive to stamp panels, its the tooling that costs money, but since the car would be designed overseas they would be saving so much money from not having to do that themselves it would be reasonably cheap to get it into production you'd imagine. Maybe half what a new Falcon would have cost, maybe even less.

2011G6E · 02-08-2012, 01:05 AM

No surprise.

The ABC radio had a motoring talk a while ago, and the presenter had visited the thriving factories in India, and was amazed at the big names now making cars there, or soon planning to.
There were the usual suspects...most of the Jap car makers (our sons Suzuki Alto is made in India), Ford, GM, Chrysler, Mercedes, BMW, and some big names like Aston Martin and others considering it...even Harley Davidson.

The American Fusion is a fantastic car...check the US Ford website and check the features (just ignore the price...it would be double that at least here).

Our almost unique requirement for cars to be RHD only stifles things a fair bit and makes common cars into expensive prestige models here. No other country seems to have such a huge problem with which side of the car the steering wheel is on.

car10002 · 02-08-2012, 01:22 AM

and whats goingto happen with getting parts for the older fords, just aftermarket only ??

falconnut · 02-08-2012, 02:10 AM

Would it be reasonable to assume that what killed/killing the falcon and other now defunt aussie made cars is a massive change in consumer taste, brand confidence and most importantly our economy?

First it was the 380, now it will be the Falcon and Commodore right?

After their going by 2018~ give or take will there be any aussie cars left they are actually built here besides toyota?

The fusion does look like a great car, i guess ill have to get used to it once the local alternative is no longer available, your right about the pricing too, hopefully if ford can produce enough RHD models the price might go down over time.

GTP534 · 02-08-2012, 08:09 AM

Here's something I just read on Carpoint. These reports need to get out there to try and provide some balance. The "Receiver" who started the speculation in the first place has no credibility and deserves to be held to account.

http://ninemsn.carpoint.com.au/news/...a-circus-31649

Cheers,

Jim

NAK302 · 02-08-2012, 08:29 AM

well if Ford go down the toilet it won't be any surprise to me.
my dad owned Fords, i owned Fords my children own Asian built cars. between my sister and i, we have 6 children, not one of them has a Ford car. i'll assume we're not a unique family in our vehicle choices, if overseas built cars are cheaper then folks will buy them especially when they aren't enthusiests. when was the last time you saw an Asian decent person driving a Ford Falcon that wasn't a renter?
it'll be a shame to see them go, after all, i've had a long time with them. having said that, they're current product does nothing to compell me to buy.

vanman_75 · 02-08-2012, 08:31 AM

Good read , we all know sorta where our car industry is heading .But some of the media dribble is unreal , they need to take some account for it ..glad to see he was shot down a little

RASER · 02-08-2012, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanman_75

Good read , we all know sorta where our car industry is heading .But some of the media dribble is unreal , they need to take some account for it ..glad to see he was shot down a little

We have only just seen the beginning of Made In China brands, standby for full force attack.

RASER · 02-08-2012, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

What is the robust export plan? 5000 cars maybe to the US as VF is not mentioned as going anywhere else, while Caprice cop car is selling up a storm.....not.

Forget USA, [although they could have had a go at the NY Taxi fleet tender] both Dick Johnson and myself agree that export was the only lifeline, but USA cannot happen.

I would think they should have had a bash at EVERY RHD market on the planet, beginning with UK [England, Scotland, Irelands] and South Africa for starters, followed by HongKong [FFS, they use large Toyota Crowns there] not just the Falcon but the Terri too.

You can see how many are here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_hand_drive

johnydep · 02-08-2012, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GT-0733

well if Ford go down the toilet it won't be any surprise to me.
my dad owned Fords, i owned Fords my children own Asian built cars. between my sister and i, we have 6 children, not one of them has a Ford car. i'll assume we're not a unique family in our vehicle choices, if overseas built cars are cheaper then folks will buy them especially when they aren't enthusiests. when was the last time you saw an Asian decent person driving a Ford Falcon that wasn't a renter?
it'll be a shame to see them go, after all, i've had a long time with them. having said that, they're current product does nothing to compell me to buy.

You make a very interesting point. My son is getting close to driving age, and he has said to me many times "why are Commodores and Falcons so bogan?" The days of school yard Ford vs Holden are gone, repaced with WRX vs 180SX vs Mitsi, etc. I think those PlayStation and PSP games have a lot to answer for.

Staying on the subject; my young cousins all drive small cars, are on their second model and chose small again.

Maka · 02-08-2012, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnydep

You make a very interesting point. My son is getting close to driving age, and he has said to me many times "why are Commodores and Falcons so bogan?" The days of school yard Ford vs Holden are gone, repaced with WRX vs 180SX vs Mitsi, etc. I think those PlayStation and PSP games have a lot to answer for.Staying on the subject; my young cousins all drive small cars, are on their second model and chose small again.

You are not alone in thinking that way lol! Dont forget Xbox! Video games are a powerful marketing tool when used correctly.

cheers,Maka

bingoTE50 · 02-08-2012, 11:47 AM

The market is definitely changing. The techno age is upon us . My son is 19 and he's peers are more interested in sport , gaming, and portability of their media.
In the last five years he has not once said ,he wants to buy a certain car when he gets the funds , before that he did. As long as the car has a decent sound system, blue tooth ,sat nav , usb , cruise and good economy ,that will be he's priority. And preferably if I bought it !!! ( not happening) ..

vztrt · 02-08-2012, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikked

What a surprise, Razor chiming in with his comments about how crap the Falcon and Ranger are, and how the f-150 needs to be sold here for a profit busting price of 30k...

He is in his own little world. One the F150 won't come here and even if it did your looking at a price that most people won't fork over when the Hilux, Ranger, etc will do the job.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildrider

what will kill the straight 6 will be tuffer emission laws. the straight 6 is actually ahead of holdens newer V6s. I really notice the difference out on the highway between the too. the holden V6 (not the horrible 3L thing) is not gutless either by anymeans in saying that.

The I6 (both petrol and gas) are already for the next emission laws.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Falcon and Territory are dead, it wether Broadmeadows assemble anything post 2016 that is now the question and is being looked at. It all depends on making a business case for it, which will only work if exports throughout Asia eventuate. I think the plan of selling the Territory in Thailand is a test case for this.
h

I really don't see why they would bother. The plant is as efficient as it can be but the problem is it's still old, and in comparison to a new high efficient plant over seas why would you bother.

Quote:

Originally Posted by csv8

Territory isn't a traditional wagon. a Sports wagon is...people who want a traditional wagon cann't buy one from Ford..

Don't see the sports wagon as traditional (seeing the small amount of room in the back). But Ford do have a Mondeo wagon.

RASER · 02-08-2012, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by car10002

and whats goingto happen with getting parts for the older fords, just aftermarket only ??

FoA will have enough genuine parts for at least 10 years or more after production stops.

U can always go to the wreckers for anything else

And if the demand is there, China will build what ever u need as long as "how many container loads" is met

Road_Warrior · 02-08-2012, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

I really don't see why they would bother. The plant is as efficient as it can be but the problem is it's still old, and in comparison to a new high efficient plant over seas why would you bother.

Sure the building may be old, but in terms of its facilities and plant there isnt a lot there that is 'old' that can't be rectified by an upgrade. Don't forget this is an assembly plant that builds modern unibody cars using modern techniques and materials - we're not talking pop-rivet guns and blokes manually using arc welders here like in the 1960's, some of the manufacturing processes introduced with the FG were a first for any Ford car in the world.

The issue with those overseas plants in Thailand etc is that they are at near capacity providing volume selling products for global markets - but there are no subsidiary plants in the region that can be 'delegated' to take care of lower tier stuff that doesnt move in as high numbers as the Fiesta, Focus etc. Dearborn has got the ***** on because despite having hundreds of millions of dollars tipped into it over the past few years to modernise some things, Broadmeadows is an asset that is underutilised and has substantial excess capacity, but the current products do not provide Ford with a hope in hell of realising that capacity.

vztrt · 02-08-2012, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Sure the building may be old, but in terms of its facilities and plant there isnt a lot there that is 'old' that can't be rectified by an upgrade. Don't forget this is an assembly plant that builds modern unibody cars using modern techniques and materials - we're not talking pop-rivet guns and blokes manually using arc welders here like in the 1960's, some of the manufacturing processes introduced with the FG were a first for any Ford car in the world.

It's not the building I'm talking about. Its the layout that is the big problem (not easily changed). It was great back in the day, not so good now.
I know what the plant is like, worked there a few years back. The best manufacturing engineers come from the car industry IMO (especially seeing some of the spags in other industries) and like I said the plant is really efficient. But there are problems with it that they cannot get around without spending money that cannot be justified.

Road_Warrior · 02-08-2012, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

It's not the building I'm talking about. Its the layout that is the big problem (not easily changed). It was great back in the day, not so good now.
I know what the plant is like, worked there a few years back. The best manufacturing engineers come from the car industry IMO (especially seeing some of the spags in other industries) and like I said the plant is really efficient. But there are problems with it that they cannot get around without spending money that cannot be justified.

Are you talking about the process lines inside, or the grounds of the plant itself? I think they can make better use of some of the space inside, for example, do they really need that large mechanics bay in the main building in there? Surely that can be moved elsewhere on the site.

brett7777 · 02-08-2012, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP534

Here's something I just read on Carpoint. These reports need to get out there to try and provide some balance. The "Receiver" who started the speculation in the first place has no credibility and deserves to be held to account.

http://ninemsn.carpoint.com.au/news/...a-circus-31649

Cheers,

Jim

Note the title tab at the top: 'Opinion'.

SpoolMan · 02-08-2012, 02:18 PM

If the red team are making a dollar from the Cruze and I am not sure if they are, then hopefully it may be viable for Ford to build a small car at Broadmeadows and return a profit.
Its a huge site they will have to do something with it..

Road_Warrior · 02-08-2012, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpoolMan

If the red team are making a dollar from the Cruze and I am not sure if they are, then hopefully it may be viable for Ford to build a small car at Broadmeadows and return a profit.
Its a huge site they will have to do something with it..

Holden have got upfront costs to do with implementing Cruze production (was it 300 million or something) that they have to amortise. On that basis alone, they can't be making money on that item. But in terms of a straight forward cost-to-build and then sell-the-car basis, then they would be.

vztrt · 02-08-2012, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Are you talking about the process lines inside, or the grounds of the plant itself? I think they can make better use of some of the space inside, for example, do they really need that large mechanics bay in the main building in there? Surely that can be moved elsewhere on the site.

More the zig zag problem they have with the line itself. It was great when they building cars back in the day but not now. Revamp of the PDA area isn't really gonna make that big of a difference. Mind you its not to bad when you watch them pumping out 500+ cars a day.

Road_Warrior · 02-08-2012, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

More the zig zag problem they have with the line itself. It was great when they building cars back in the day but not now. Revamp of the PDA area isn't really gonna make that big of a difference. Mind you its not to bad when you watch them pumping out 500+ cars a day.

Aah yes I gotcha now. Yes they have done quite well to cram all that stuff in there, considering. I was amazed when I watched a welding robot work on an FG side panel, then change its own welding head, and then bugger off and do something else! I think that said robot then picked up the entire side panel, fed it up through an opening in the roof support beams to another process line running above our heads, where it met the rest of the car. Amazing stuff to watch a car getting built.

vztrt · 02-08-2012, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Aah yes I gotcha now. Yes they have done quite well to cram all that stuff in there, considering. I was amazed when I watched a welding robot work on an FG side panel, then change its own welding head, and then bugger off and do something else! I think that said robot then picked up the entire side panel, fed it up through an opening in the roof support beams to another process line running above our heads, where it met the rest of the car. Amazing stuff to watch a car getting built.

The money that gets spent in there for new machines and processes are very high (but they would have a ROI to justify it). I would love to see what they could do building a new plant if the money was there.

Pretty sure they would have heavy involvement in the o/s plants...especially after the South Africa debacle.