XR8 vs SSV including dyno test - Page 6

TK4ORD · 10-01-2015, 09:01 PM

The one thing that seems to be left out of reviews and has not been mentioned in these 4 pages that would be a interesting fact to know,
would be the difference in how much Australian engineering and content has gone into/and is in each car?

Afterall they are being touted as "Australian" Muscle cars!!!!!!!!

BENT_8 · 10-01-2015, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

Not really because the retest of the gtf pulled its highest power on the 9th run... Even on hot days so far I haven't felt the power fall off.

No one explained that first gtf dyno the people involved let it silently slip away.

Ok, for some reason I thought it was the first controversial test that saw the GTF run a number of times before giving a low reading, I couldn't find the thread to be certain. I just remember them running it a number of times and drew a comparison to this XR8 test.

GTP534 · 10-01-2015, 09:16 PM

The funny thing is, if the boot was on the other foot, as in the XR8 had all the bells and whistles and the overall chassis refinement (as other comparos have pointed out for the SSV) and it was the SSV with the engine and straightline performance, I'm 100% sure we would all be just as passionate about our cars!

For me, I wouldn't criticise the Commodore for having all that tech, I would love to see it in the Falcon. Once it was given the thumbs down there's no way Ford was going to throw money on such things.

I'm looking forward to Mustang and those very tech features will be more than likely standard equipment.

It makes me wonder what we can get so passionate about once Falcon and Commodore are gone.

Iggle Piggle · 10-01-2015, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FG2-XR6

At the end, a true Ford tragic (like me)
will buy a Falcon &
a true Holden one will buy the Commodore
no matter what the other car has or hasn't
or does this better then that.

Totally agree.

What I think is testament to the awesomeness of both of these cars is the fact that there are several people that, while maybe not "true tragics", they still have a heavy bias towards or fondness of one brand yet they have gone with the offering from the other brand as it is better suited to their needs and wants.

This has happened on both sides of the divide - there are some on LS1 that are unashamedly Holden biased yet they have not been able to resist the superior power and straight line speed of the Miami; while equally there are obviously some here that are unashamedly Ford guys yet they have found the Holden 'package' is a better match for their needs and have gone that way instead.

In previous years/models the offerings from both camps were not so far apart as to be able to make someone switch from their preferred brand - the fact that both vehicles are capable of swaying some people away from their preferred brand validates the approach both have taken.

Then there are those very few that I envy enormously as they are lucky enough to have enough coin to go down the little taco girl's path of "Why can't we have both" - they have one of each in their fleet and drive whichever suits their mood or journey.

Tezza · 10-01-2015, 09:25 PM

Another interesting discussion point to partially get back on topic would be to also bring the HSV clubsport into the mix. Even though the xr8 and ssvr share the same RRP, a quick look at car sales shows there is plenty of discount for a ssvr, while the xr8 is into low $60k territory which is the same $$ as a HSV Clubsport.

Now while i would take the xr8 in a heartbeat over an ssvr, the clubsport with the better drivetrain (ls3, diff ratio and gearbox) for the same money would have me stopping to think a little bit harder. An extra 65kw (80kw with the performance pack) goes a long way to bridging the gap to the xr8. Then some of the "niceties would start to have more of an influence (blind spot warning, heads up display etc...)

graphicgoose · 10-01-2015, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tezza

Another interesting discussion point to partially get back on topic would be to also bring the HSV clubsport into the mix. Even though the xr8 and ssvr share the same RRP, a quick look at car sales shows there is plenty of discount for a ssvr, while the xr8 is into low $60k territory which is the same $$ as a HSV Clubsport.

Now while i would take the xr8 in a heartbeat over an ssvr, the clubsport with the better drivetrain (ls3, diff ratio and gearbox) for the same money would have me stopping to think a little bit harder. An extra 65kw (80kw with the performance pack) goes a long way to bridging the gap to the xr8. Then some of the "niceties would start to have more of an influence (blind spot warning, heads up display etc...)

The SSVR and Clubby have the same gearbox do they not? 6L80E for the autos and the TR6060 for the manuals...

Tezza · 10-01-2015, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graphicgoose

The SSVR and Clubby have the same gearbox do they not? 6L80E for the autos and the TR6060 for the manuals...

Yeah possibly, I'm not to sure. I thought the HSV's were strengthened though to cope with the extra power. Could be wrong though?

The diff ratio goes from 2.92 in the ss to 3.27 in the clubsport (in the auto) which is a lot better, and the ls3 speaks for itself....

graphicgoose · 10-01-2015, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tezza

Yeah possibly, I'm not to sure. I thought the HSV's were strengthened though to cope with the extra power. Could be wrong though?

The diff ratio goes from 2.92 in the ss to 3.27 in the clubsport (in the auto) which is a lot better, and the ls3 speaks for itself....

They both have the 6L80E, the GTS has 6L90E. I didn't know the clubby had a different diff ratio...that's interesting! LS3 would be nice in the Redline, supposed to be going into the MY16 model.

40RDT · 10-01-2015, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duaned

So who's game to fit a Miami in a SSV Commodore? That would be the Ultimate in motoring!

Why would you bother with a miami when you can buy an LSA crate motor for around 10k

SensationFG8 · 10-01-2015, 09:56 PM

Probably because the Miami has awesome volumetric efficiency and is genuinely a great motor...

40RDT · 10-01-2015, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

Probably because the Miami has awesome volumetric efficiency and is genuinely a great motor...

Both great motors but BFYB an intercooled 6.2L LSA for around 10k is hard to beat

SensationFG8 · 10-01-2015, 10:48 PM

I'd take the hand assembled motor any day.

40RDT · 10-01-2015, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

I'd take the hand assembled motor any day.

Well knowing how ford charge for parts you could probably buy an LSA motor and rebuild it with better internals etc for less than the price of a new Miami engine haha

SensationFG8 · 10-01-2015, 11:02 PM

Yeah cos ford is the only car company to charge crazy prices for parts...

mik · 10-01-2015, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 40RDT

Why would you bother with a miami when you can buy an LSA crate motor for around 10k

supplied, fitted bugs worked out, and legal i suspect might end up a tad more than 10 k .

skoobysGT · 10-01-2015, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FG2-XR6

At the end, a true Ford tragic (like me)
will buy a Falcon &
a true Holden one will buy the Commodore
no matter what the other car has or hasn't
or does this better then that.

True. .But for the rest of us who are neither red or blue will purchase a car which has the best overall package and best value for money hence I went for the GTS over the GTF and others who have gone with the SS over the XR8

**Falcon Coupe** · 10-01-2015, 11:29 PM

We really are nitpicking and going around in a circle again, such are the way of forums.

SensationFG8 · 10-01-2015, 11:30 PM

Yep I went for the best package too, hence gtf over the gts and hence I'd go xr8 over ss.

Best package is subjective to what you want from a car.

40RDT · 10-01-2015, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik

supplied, fitted bugs worked out, and legal i suspect might end up a tad more than 10 k .

Yeah no doubt, 10k is supply only. I think everyone is missing the point, it would be a hell of a lot cheaper and easier to throw an LSA motor in a commodore than it would be to put a Miami engine in.

1TUFFUTE · 10-01-2015, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pottery beige

and the offer is still open dude

drinking beer and talking cars is much more fun than arguing on computerz

As sif bro.....

skoobysGT · 10-01-2015, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

Yep I went for the best package too, hence gtf over the gts and hence I'd go xr8 over ss.

Best package is subjective to what you want from a car.

It only becomes subjective if you have red or blue running through your veins.

When you're neutral you go for the best package available at the time hence there are many more Commodores sold then Falcons

arronm · 11-01-2015, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

Yep I went for the best package too, hence gtf over the gts and hence I'd go xr8 over ss.

The difference between the XR8 and SSV may be great but the GTF and GTS is light years.

The GTS has torque vectoring and magnetic suspension, and multiple setting for the TC and ESC

The GTF has on or off. That says it all.

I am a die hard FORD guy, but when it was time for my new work car, the choice was obvious SSV-R.

And what made it worse was I couldn't even consider the ford wagon as they dont have one.

Tezza · 11-01-2015, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skoobysGT

It only becomes subjective if you have red or blue running through your veins.

When you're neutral you go for the best package available at the time hence there are many more Commodores sold then Falcons

Really?? I would have said it is because there is more Holden fans than Ford.
A bit like why the Hilux is still the best selling 4wd ute. There is no way anyone in their right mind can consider the Hilux a better package than a Ranger in 2014, yet it smashes it in sales. Just shows how brand loyal people can be and how past reputations count for a lot.....

arronm · 11-01-2015, 12:04 AM

Its because every mine site has 1000 hilux..

pottery beige · 11-01-2015, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

As sif bro.....

you want to come and drink my beers as well

b0son · 11-01-2015, 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

Yep I went for the best package too, hence gtf over the gts and hence I'd go xr8 over ss.

Best package is subjective to what you want from a car.

To a degree, but it seems your method is to whittle away the parts of the 'package' that don't mean much to you until you're left comparing on the only couple of criteria that matter to you. That's not really comparing the package, is it?

1TUFFUTE · 11-01-2015, 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pottery beige

you want to come and drink my beers as well

Sorry I'm not sure where South aus is......is that a country somewhere?

Struggo · 11-01-2015, 02:54 AM

I think its great that we have these two great cars built in Australia, come 2016/17 its game over.

If I win lotto in the near future, I'd like one of each please :-)

SensationFG8 · 11-01-2015, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

To a degree, but it seems your method is to whittle away the parts of the 'package' that don't mean much to you until you're left comparing on the only couple of criteria that matter to you. That's not really comparing the package, is it?

It sure is a fine way to compare depending on what you want. I don't want a car that intervenes with torque vectoring and trick magnetic suspension. Why is that so hard for you holden guys to grasp?

Sometimes less is more, you think only you have made the right choice with your car, that simply isn't true, you made the right choice for YOU. That doesn't mean it's the right choice for everyone.

There are only a few people here that insist one car is the only one you could possibly choose. I personally accept that people like the tech in the holden and that's why they chose it.

The holden boys say "you can't accept the holden is a better package", I accept the holden has things the Ford does not, no argument there. What I won't concede is that makes it better. It sure is better for those that want it, its not for those who don't.

Looks - ford
Sound - ford
Road driving (this review) - ford
Tech - holden
Track - holden
Acceleration - ford
Fun factor - ford

Score 5-2 in favor of ford, the Tech has a lot of things to make up for to make it "better".

There is the summary in my mind, is that not a complete enough view if things? Why claim I'm not looking at the package? I'd be ok if you claimed I don't place the emphasis on tech that you do because thats what I've been saying.

mtbkym01 · 11-01-2015, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensationFG8

It sure is a fine way to compare depending on what you want. I don't want a car that intervenes with torque vectoring and trick magnetic suspension. Why is that so hard for you holden guys to grasp?

Sometimes less is more, you think only you have made the right choice with your car, that simply isn't true, you made the right choice for YOU. That doesn't mean it's the right choice for everyone.

There are only a few people here that insist one car is the only one you could possibly choose. I personally accept that people like the tech in the holden and that's why they chose it.

The holden boys say "you can't accept the holden is a better package", I accept the holden has things the Ford does not, no argument there. What I won't concede is that makes it better. It sure is better for those that want it, its not for those who don't.

Looks - ford
Sound - ford
Road driving (this review) - ford
Tech - holden
Track - holden
Acceleration - ford
Fun factor - ford

Score 5-2 in favor of ford, the Tech has a lot of things to make up for to make it "better".

There is the summary in my mind, is that not a complete enough view if things? Why claim I'm not looking at the package? I'd be ok if you claimed I don't place the emphasis on tech that you do because thats what I've been saying.

Brilliant post