drive.com.au tests new Ecoboost Falcon! - Page 3

jpd80 · 25-04-2012, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP-03

What about people who tow caravans and big trailers etc? Theres got to be a market for the 6, even if its in lpi form only.

If the I-6 went away, I think FoA would need to have a V6 diesel option in there to keep towers happy but
the performance of the EB engine should tell you that it is more than capable of towing just as much as the I-6.
The only reason Ecoboost is restricted to 1600 Kg is because Ford hasn't furnished it with a 2300 kg towing kit.
Doing that would be a declaration of war against the I-6 engine which is something Ford want to avoid ATM.
So it will be interesting to see whether I-6 sales come back to life of if buyers change alleigances and go with EB.

If you tow a big trailer or a caravan, do what most people do and buy a diesel Territory..

GTP-03 · 25-04-2012, 11:49 AM

Would be a shame to see the I6 motor fade away, especially as the turbo version is such a cracker of an engine, the I6 is a true workhouse which needs little maintenance, but youve got to move with the times, and times have definantly changed

**DJM83** · 25-04-2012, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

If the I-6 went away, I think FoA would need to have a V6 diesel option in there to keep towers happy but
the performance of the EB engine should tell you that it is more than capable of towing just as much as the I-6.
The only reason Ecoboost is restricted to 1600 Kg is because Ford hasn't furnished it with a 2300 kg towing kit.
Doing that would be a declaration of war against the I-6 engine which is something Ford want to avoid ATM.
So it will be interesting to see whether I-6 sales come back to life of if buyers change alleigances and go with EB.

If you tow a big trailer or a caravan, do what most people do and buy a diesel Territory..

If that is indeed the case i see it as a good thing for FoA having a couple of decent options for the punters can only be a good thing right? Hope thats the case.

prydey · 25-04-2012, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP-03

What about people who tow caravans and big trailers etc? Theres got to be a market for the 6, even if its in lpi form only.

having just driven to bris and back (from adelaide), i came across plenty of caravans (more than normal) and i don't think i saw one that was being towed by a falcon or commodore or any passenger sedan.

**Polyal** · 25-04-2012, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

having just driven to bris and back (from adelaide), i came across plenty of caravans (more than normal) and i don't think i saw one that was being towed by a falcon or commodore or any passenger sedan.

Funny because a recent trip to ACT showed me that there a lots of fords being used, and actually not one commy. A few klugers and dual cabs too.

naddis01 · 25-04-2012, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP-03

What about people who tow caravans and big trailers etc? Theres got to be a market for the 6, even if its in lpi form only.

They will buy an SUV like they have been for years.

.FoMoCo. · 25-04-2012, 04:27 PM

I'm still surprised at those 0-100 times. The Ecoboost falcon has an inferior power to weight ratio to the I6 falcon...

FG XT I6 = 195KW ; kerb weight = 1710 KG ; KG per KW = 8.77

FG XT Ecoboost = 179KW ; kerb weight = 1648 KG ; KG per KW = 9.2

...but the delivery of torque is another story:

Ecoboost = 353NM @2000 RPM

I6 = 391NM @3250 RPM

(figures according to redbook)

It seems the ecoboost is getting a good surge of pulling power just off idle. Sounds fun to drive!

Nikked · 25-04-2012, 04:32 PM

the EcoBoost has a flat curve...hits 353 and stays there...

jpd80 · 25-04-2012, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by .FoMoCo.

I'm still surprised at those 0-100 times. The Ecoboost falcon has an inferior power to weight ratio to the I6 falcon...

I-6 has basically sat still with little developemnt in the past 10 years.
Ford is aiming to get the EB 1.6 to this performance level in the next 4 years.

Bossxr8 · 25-04-2012, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikked

3.0l SIDI's only do it in 7.6

From other road tests i've seen in more like mid to high 8's. Its a total slug the 3.0 Sisi.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

IMO this engine is going to replace the I6 in all Falcons bar the turbo variants and a few select orders where people specifically want the I6.

If the Ecoboost Falcon fires in the sales charts like it should, then this will become the volume seller.

It won't because its not available in the highest selling model, the XR6. Based on build numbers its roughly substituted maybe 20 I6's a day. They obviously aren't expecting much from it.

They probably won't even advertise it and then wonder why it doesn't sell. It could be the best engine in the world but unless they make the public aware of it they are just pssingg in the wind.

jpd80 · 25-04-2012, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

From other road tests i've seen in more like mid to high 8's. Its a total slug the 3.0 Sisi.

It won't because its not available in the highest selling model, the XR6. Based on build numbers its roughly substituted maybe 20 I6's a day. They obviously aren't expecting much from it.

They probably won't even advertise it and then wonder why it doesn't sell. It could be the best engine in the world but unless they make the public aware of it they are just pssingg in the wind.

Not to mention that they could only get 2,000 odd in the first order..

See, this is why we really need to reconfigure some of the engine line here to at least assemble Ecoboost and 2.0 TDCI engines
and then start building Mondeos here too..

atmoxr6 · 25-04-2012, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by .FoMoCo.

I'm still surprised at those 0-100 times. The Ecoboost falcon has an inferior power to weight ratio to the I6 falcon...

FG XT I6 = 195KW ; kerb weight = 1710 KG ; KG per KW = 8.77

FG XT Ecoboost = 179KW ; kerb weight = 1648 KG ; KG per KW = 9.2

...but the delivery of torque is another story:

Ecoboost = 353NM @2000 RPM

I6 = 391NM @3250 RPM

(figures according to redbook)

It seems the ecoboost is getting a good surge of pulling power just off idle. Sounds fun to drive!

slightly lower gearing in the ecoboost? read an article last nite that it does 1900rpm at 100k's, my xr6 sits on 1750rpm at 100k's. not big difference but still. does it use the ford lic 6spd or the zf box?

prydey · 25-04-2012, 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atmoxr6

slightly lower gearing in the ecoboost? read an article last nite that it does 1900rpm at 100k's, my xr6 sits on 1750rpm at 100k's. not big difference but still. does it use the ford lic 6spd or the zf box?

the box is still zf i believe but baby brother to the one in the 6cyl. ratios are the same. revs will be different as you are comparing a 6cyl to a 4cyl.

also, my zf xr6 sits around 1600rpm in 6th at 100 i think. 1750 is closer to 110 i reckon.

mik · 25-04-2012, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naddis01

They will buy an SUV like they have been for years.

some of us won`t ;)

prydey · 26-04-2012, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mik

some of us won`t ;)

thats the beauty of the australian automotive market. there is more choice than nearly all other countries.

falcon can no longer be a 'one size fits all' car. if you need a falcon tow car, then buy the 6cyl.

Bossxr8 · 26-04-2012, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atmoxr6

slightly lower gearing in the ecoboost? read an article last nite that it does 1900rpm at 100k's, my xr6 sits on 1750rpm at 100k's. not big difference but still. does it use the ford lic 6spd or the zf box?

I though the gearing on all ZF 6 speeds is exactly the same.

Have to see what the diff ratio is.

mik · 26-04-2012, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

the box is still zf i believe but baby brother to the one in the 6cyl. ratios are the same. revs will be different as you are comparing a 6cyl to a 4cyl.

also, my zf xr6 sits around 1600rpm in 6th at 100 i think. 1750 is closer to 110 i reckon.

that`s pretty good Prydey, yours must be awesome on the highway, should last forever too, i can`t think of too many buzz boxes that can match the effortless nature of the Falcon six potter, the EB sounds like it should be a nice effortless 4 potter as well.
even the older 6 potters like my Au and earlier, i have to cross a very busy main road and go for a break in the traffic daily , and the old 6 you don`t even have to give more than a third throttle(maybe less) and it just moves quickly across the road with no fuss and no effort much like a V8,
stress free motoring , i love it..

vztrt · 26-04-2012, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

having just driven to bris and back (from adelaide), i came across plenty of caravans (more than normal) and i don't think i saw one that was being towed by a falcon or commodore or any passenger sedan.

I always find this comment surprising from people as when I'm on the highway I normally see the Falcon 6 being used to tow a caravan. Quite funny I've seen two commo's but both were 8's (not really surprised by this).

But it is good to see that the new ecoboost is getting good reviews. Hopefully it increases sales and produces profits.

**Mechan1k** · 26-04-2012, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

If the I-6 went away, I think FoA would need to have a V6 diesel option in there to keep towers happy but
the performance of the EB engine should tell you that it is more than capable of towing just as much as the I-6.
The only reason Ecoboost is restricted to 1600 Kg is because Ford hasn't furnished it with a 2300 kg towing kit.
Doing that would be a declaration of war against the I-6 engine which is something Ford want to avoid ATM.
So it will be interesting to see whether I-6 sales come back to life of if buyers change alleigances and go with EB.

If you tow a big trailer or a caravan, do what most people do and buy a diesel Territory..

There's also the option of sourcing the EB V6 out of the F-trucks from the US .... an amazing engine that is perfectly suited to any sort of towing duties.

chevypower · 26-04-2012, 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

There's also the option of sourcing the EB V6 out of the F-trucks from the US .... an amazing engine that is perfectly suited to any sort of towing duties.

That engine is rated to pull 11,100 lb (5,000 kg) in the US (F-150).

**Mechan1k** · 26-04-2012, 04:58 AM

Exactly ... the perfect towing engine

A little overkill here for sedans ... but I won't be complaining if we get it ... hee hee

.FoMoCo. · 26-04-2012, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

There's also the option of sourcing the EB V6 out of the F-trucks from the US .... an amazing engine that is perfectly suited to any sort of towing duties.

That thing is an animal...270 KW@5000 RPM ; an incredible 570 NM @2500 RPM!
...90% of the torque is available at 1700RPM...

In the F150 it is EPA rated at 18MPG or 13L/100KM in a beefy 2200KG vehicle.

It can tow 5 tonnes...

It pushes the F150 to a 0-60 time of around 6.5!!

Apparently it is cheaper to build than the diesel engines as well.

Can you imagine that thing in a falcon?

They have dropped that engine in the Taurus SHO in the states, and it shoots it to a 0-60 time of 5.1 seconds. Not sure why, but torque on that engine is down to 475NM.

4.0i OHC · 26-04-2012, 08:48 AM

Wretched · 26-04-2012, 08:56 AM

Why would they do that?
What advantage would it have?

Auslandau · 26-04-2012, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4.0i OHC

image

Yes .... Why? The 3.5 V6 twin turbo Ecoboost compared to the I6 ...... Bit like 351 clevo vs 5.0 coyote

Road_Warrior · 26-04-2012, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

There's also the option of sourcing the EB V6 out of the F-trucks from the US .... an amazing engine that is perfectly suited to any sort of towing duties.

No there 'aint, it was ruled out during the FG V6 development period because of cost, fitment and emissions issues. Such is the problem one has when the whole front end architecture of your car is designed around an I6.

.FoMoCo. · 26-04-2012, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

No there 'aint, it was ruled out during the FG V6 development period because of cost, fitment and emissions issues. Such is the problem one has when the whole front end architecture of your car is designed around an I6.

Well if doomsday arrives, and the falcon heads for the chop, we could do alot worse than that taurus/v6 ecoboost combo...

Mad_Pom · 26-04-2012, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

I though the gearing on all ZF 6 speeds is exactly the same.

Have to see what the diff ratio is.

According to http://www.ford.com.au/cars/new-falc...s/spec-options

Dif Ratio is the same for I6, Eco LPI & EcoBoost - 2.73

**Mechan1k** · 26-04-2012, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by .FoMoCo.

Well if doomsday arrives, and the falcon heads for the chop, we could do alot worse than that taurus/v6 ecoboost combo...

Exactly ... the Taurus of today is not the Taurus of the 90's that they tried to push on us previously.

jpd80 · 26-04-2012, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechan1k

Exactly ... the Taurus of today is not the Taurus of the 90's that they tried to push on us previously.

I'm lead to believe that there are no technical issues holding back the I-6, even for post 2016 use....

Funny how everyone just naturally assumes that Ford has already signed off next big car as FWD.