Overtaking, Just how hard it is to do it Safely and Legally!

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by teak81

Well out on most highway's around the country where you see trucks overtaking each other; we are usually in radio contact with each other and the vehicle being overtaken slows down until the maneuver is completed, and usually the slower vehicle will call you around when it is safe to do so. I also have a two way in my car and use the same methods, thus no speeding when overtaking, just work together. I work on the theory that if a vehicle behind has caught up to me whilst I am sitting on the speedlimit and if I let them pass they will also be able to drive away from me thus not impeding me or them.

done a night run karratha to headland in work ute.. ch40 for background...

pulled over just out of headland for a weeee....

ch40.... hahahaha check him out couldnt hang for another ten...

whoooosh goes a truck.. whoooosh goes another truck....

took the **** out of me for the next ten minutes..

[blackf6]

Originally Posted by pottery beige

done a night run karratha to headland in work ute.. ch40 for background...

pulled over just out of headland for a weeee....

ch40.... hahahaha check him out couldnt hang for another ten...

whoooosh goes a truck.. whoooosh goes another truck....

took the **** out of me for the next ten minutes..

Silly buggers, think only truckies tune in to channel 40.

[new2ford]

A lot of this angst would be avoided if European driving protocols were followed. There, on a single lane road, if there's room on the shoulder, a slower car will move over to the side (the left in Australian terms), still driving, to allow a faster car behind to pass. You do it every time, no question. In Australia only the occasional truck driver will show such consideration. Road authorities are now extensively putting in wide shoulders on new/upgrade work so there's plenty of scope for pulling over to let others pass.

Consideration for others and watching the mirror is something that should be rammed in at the learner stage and absorbed into driver behaviour.

[302 XC]

Originally Posted by new2ford

A lot of this angst would be avoided if European driving protocols were followed. There, on a single lane road, if there's room on the shoulder, a slower car will move over to the side (the left in Australian terms), still driving, to allow a faster car behind to pass. You do it every time, no question. In Australia only the occasional truck driver will show such consideration. Road authorities are now extensively putting in wide shoulders on new/upgrade work so there's plenty of scope for pulling over to let others pass.

Consideration for others and watching the mirror is something that should be rammed in at the learner stage and absorbed into driver behaviour.

I used to move over a tad when i had my canter and large trailer
For a 4 potta diesel it would pull ayers rock outta the ground, but with the overall weight at 100 Ks at hills, it wasnt real fast
But everytime i moved to let those less patient than myself go past, there was always another car,truck,bus, bike that wanted to squeeze past at the last second
Trying to get moving at near standing start up hills got annoying,and all to help someone else get past
My attitude became, i can go as slow as i like, i pay more rego,insurnace than most and IF my truck was goin slow feel free to pull the weight with your little buzz box
I think those who think trucks are slow,should try drive one sometime

[mik]

Originally Posted by new2ford

A lot of this angst would be avoided if European driving protocols were followed. There, on a single lane road, if there's room on the shoulder, a slower car will move over to the side (the left in Australian terms), still driving, to allow a faster car behind to pass. You do it every time, no question. In Australia only the occasional truck driver will show such consideration. Road authorities are now extensively putting in wide shoulders on new/upgrade work so there's plenty of scope for pulling over to let others pass.

Consideration for others and watching the mirror is something that should be rammed in at the learner stage and absorbed into driver behaviour.

there are other considerations for the truck driver as well, moving over in a truck could put wheels in the stones, you will often find on the shoulder there is loose stones i`m sure the guys behind won`t appreciate a spray of stones hitting their duco and windscreen.
Add to that trucks often have a higher centre of gravity, depending on the load, if they hit undulation on the edge of the road could become unstable and start to sway, truck drivers won`t weave in and out to let car drivers go past, it`s much easier to maneuver a car than a truck, your not speed limited, you need to have a bit of patience and pick your spot.

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by mik

there are other considerations for the truck driver as well, moving over in a truck could put wheels in the stones, you will often find on the shoulder there is loose stones i`m sure the guys behind won`t appreciate a spray of stones hitting their duco and windscreen.
Add to that trucks often have a higher centre of gravity, depending on the load, if they hit undulation on the edge of the road could become unstable and start to sway, truck drivers won`t weave in and out to let car drivers go past, it`s much easier to maneuver a car than a truck, your not speed limited, you need to have a bit of patience and pick your spot.

My comments relate basically to car drivers and where there is a wide sealed shoulder. I don't expect trucks to put two wheels in the dirt. I think everyone appreciates those truckies who let people pass if there's an opportunity to do so.

It also shows that as professional drivers they're looking in their mirrors and checking the environment around them, which is what many car drivers who cause km-long tailbacks don't. Which is the point I'm making. Anybody is entitled to drive slowly, but they need to be aware of the flow-on effects of them doing so and thus respond with courtesy and consideration.

All of this works fine in Europe, no reason it can't work fine in Australia.

[zakjames]

As new2ford brought up the attention of,

Before I had traveled through Europe and even Dubai I must admit I was much more selfish on the road then I am today (Was about 18 at the time). I narrowed it down to the fact I had only ever driven in conditions with other selfish people on the road with me. But seeing the driving and selflessness of people on the road in Europe, and even the initiative of those in Dubai putting on their hazards lights when approaching a red light around a blind corner I completely changed my habits to a much safer and courteous driver with much more awareness around me. If everyone was to experience how other drivers act on the road in European countries it would be a much safer and predictable place to drive here in Australia.

[Nova 8]

If the car in front is doing 97 and the limit is 100, you dont over take. Even if you travel for 10hrs at 97 instead of 100 it only adds about 20mins to your trip. If i find it too frustrating (generally when I cant just set cruise) I just pull over and get a drink and a bite to eat as someone with only 1 probationary point I am not gonna risk it. The other choice is you knowingly risk the points and over take and when you get caught cry hard done by. Its that simple, as for when people are doing >10km under the speed limit you just over take. If my memory is correct it takes 2km to over take a B-double doing 100km if you are traveling at 110km. All this is covered in the learners book, having a read might be advised.


Just a note, I didnt lose my license for speeding. I lost my license as my P plate peeled off the window on a hot day and the cop behind me saw it, pulled me over and fined me - its breach of my provisionary license and i immediately lost my license. Appealed for it back and got a 3 yr extension... 3 mths to go until i get my p's. Currently all 4 of my P plates are taped to my windows.

[prydey]

whilst many think speeding isn't dangerous or contributing to the road toll, i fully believe attitude and impatience is one of the biggest contributors to the road toll.

this thread highlights just how prevalent impatience is in our society.

rather than allow plenty of time for your journey, you get annoyed at the person who dares hold up your important life for 5 min.

[tvboy]

Originally Posted by prydey

whilst many think speeding isn't dangerous or contributing to the road toll, i fully believe attitude and impatience is one of the biggest contributors to the road toll.

this thread highlights just how prevalent impatience is in our society.

rather than allow plenty of time for your journey, you get annoyed at the person who dares hold up your important life for 5 min.

Why do assume someone is annoyed or impatient just because they performing a simple overtaking manouvere? Slow drivers dont really bother me thats why my car has a steering wheel.
I don't get annoyed. I get around.

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by prydey

whilst many think speeding isn't dangerous or contributing to the road toll, i fully believe attitude and impatience is one of the biggest contributors to the road toll.

this thread highlights just how prevalent impatience is in our society.

rather than allow plenty of time for your journey, you get annoyed at the person who dares hold up your important life for 5 min.

impatient.. nah.. i cant handle incompetence..

[my_gxl]

Originally Posted by Nova 8

If the car in front is doing 97 and the limit is 100, you dont over take. Even if you travel for 10hrs at 97 instead of 100 it only adds about 20mins to your trip. If i find it too frustrating (generally when I cant just set cruise) I just pull over and get a drink and a bite to eat as someone with only 1 probationary point I am not gonna risk it. The other choice is you knowingly risk the points and over take and when you get caught cry hard done by. Its that simple, as for when people are doing >10km under the speed limit you just over take. If my memory is correct it takes 2km to over take a B-double doing 100km if you are traveling at 110km. All this is covered in the learners book, having a read might be advised.


Just a note, I didnt lose my license for speeding. I lost my license as my P plate peeled off the window on a hot day and the cop behind me saw it, pulled me over and fined me - its breach of my provisionary license and i immediately lost my license. Appealed for it back and got a 3 yr extension... 3 mths to go until i get my p's. Currently all 4 of my P plates are taped to my windows.

Plates should be on the extremities of the car, not in windows.

[Nova 8]

Originally Posted by my_gxl

Plates should be on the extremities of the car, not in windows.

In SA the law is plates must be clearly visable from the front and the rear of the vehicle (rear only for motorbikes). In the window is perfectly legal.

Edit: had a read of the QLD law, how can you use a magnettic plate on the front of the car and have it "clearly" visable. Its Facing up not forward?

[tvboy]

One of the worst things you can do is tailgate the vehicle you want to overtake. It means you have to get right over the dividing line to see oncoming traffic, which may already be through your windscreen when you see it. I just hang back 50ish metres, wait for a good clear stretch and sink the slipper. That gets you to overtaking speed before you cross the line. Doesn't give idiot drivers a chance to speed up to stop you getting past either.

[vanman_75]

I'm not inpatient , I give em the first and sometimes the second chance to go past a slower vehicle ....after that its my turn , take the lot , passing speed never enters the equation .I hate sitting behind people that are tail gating the slower vehicle , head on waiting to happen and I ain't gunna be no witness or part of that .caught in traffic with idiots will far outway me overtaking ...period !
Lessons learnt from 1-2 million clicks , I can just about tell you what the idiots are gunna do .awareness and courtesy would save more lives than any set rules , its the way I deal with it .and on the flip side I will drop away from bad displays of driving just as quick , for me its not the time test but more a - get there on my terms alive and safe deal .

[zilo]

I find going a bit over the limit makes me concentrate more and hence a safer trip....

So always overtaking and looking out fopr unmarked cop cars.

I go to sleep at the wheel on cruise and 99km/h

[IDT]

The OP is complaining about the guy in front doing 3kph slower. What is the accuracy requirement for a Speedo? If we all put our cruise control on 100kph everyone would have a brain explosion. Bit of patience required in that case. Those that sit on 80 in a 100 zone then there is no problem you can do your 20kph faster than the other guy. If you want to drive above the limit, and we are all guilty of it to varying degrees, dont complain when you get pinged for it we all know better.

New2Ford, you are dead right, its the lack of consideration for those behind, beside, infront and anywhere else thats the real problem.

[tweeked]

Originally Posted by IDT

The OP is complaining about the guy in front doing 3kph slower. What is the accuracy requirement for a Speedo? If we all put our cruise control on 100kph everyone would have a brain explosion. Bit of patience required in that case. Those that sit on 80 in a 100 zone then there is no problem you can do your 20kph faster than the other guy. If you want to drive above the limit, and we are all guilty of it to varying degrees, dont complain when you get pinged for it we all know better.

New2Ford, you are dead right, its the lack of consideration for those behind, beside, infront and anywhere else thats the real problem.

You are totally missing the point of the thread. I am not complaining about the guy going slower. I am happy for anyone to travel 5-10 k's under the limit, as long as they AND the law allow me to pass safely. I am pointing out the danger of 10 odd cars banking up behind this car. It is more dangerous than just making it easier and legal to perform a perfectly safe overtake.

The "just be patient" responses just amaze me. If you think you can make the whole world patient i will tip my hat to you. Do you pick the longest queue out of those available because you are patient? Walk behind someone who is walking slowly in the street because you are patient? No, I am sure you dont. If the guys speedo is out, let me with a GPS confirmed correct one pass him safely please!!!!

Passing people is a fact of life, sometimes I wish I was a tree!

[IDT]

Originally Posted by tweeked

You are totally missing the point of the thread. I am not complaining about the guy going slower. I am happy for anyone to travel 5-10 k's under the limit, as long as they AND the law allow me to pass safely. I am pointing out the danger of 10 odd cars banking up behind this car. It is more dangerous than just making it easier and legal to perform a perfectly safe overtake.

The "just be patient" responses just amaze me. If you think you can make the whole world patient i will tip my hat to you. Do you pick the longest queue out of those available because you are patient? Walk behind someone who is walking slowly in the street because you are patient? No, I am sure you dont. If the guys speedo is out, let me with a GPS confirmed correct one pass him safely please!!!!

Passing people is a fact of life, sometimes I wish I was a tree!

No I respect other people and dont simply assume people are out to **** me off. If I am the last guy to arrive at the counter I dont hate the person in front because their trolley is full and I dont think I am missing the point at all, you either want people to get out of your way or the law changed to allow you to overtake because someone doing 97 in a 100 zone (your example) is making traffic bank up. So lets examine your kind of ideas. Scenario 1.The guy slows enough for you and the cars behind to overtake under the limit. Its a friday and everyone is heading south for the weekend and there are 20 cars banked up, this is safe? Scenario 2. He pulls over and waits for everyone to go past. Busy road the poor bastard sit on the side of the road till midnight, but hey you got to where you are going so screw him. Scenario 3. Everyone is allowed to speed 20kph over the limit to overtake, I can just see the M4 now. Scenario 4. The proper thing to do. You leave earlier, allow for traffic, and wait til its either safe to overtake and when the opportunity arises to overtake do it safely, legally and courteously. Yes it is frustrating and to be honest I accept it can be a real pain in the $%#@. But lets face it, it is the right thing to do.

[tweeked]

Originally Posted by IDT

No I respect other people and dont simply assume people are out to **** me off. If I am the last guy to arrive at the counter I dont hate the person in front because their trolley is full and I dont think I am missing the point at all, you either want people to get out of your way or the law changed to allow you to overtake because someone doing 97 in a 100 zone (your example) is making traffic bank up. So lets examine your kind of ideas. Scenario 1.The guy slows enough for you and the cars behind to overtake under the limit. Its a friday and everyone is heading south for the weekend and there are 20 cars banked up, this is safe? Scenario 2. He pulls over and waits for everyone to go past. Busy road the poor bastard sit on the side of the road till midnight, but hey you got to where you are going so screw him. Scenario 3. Everyone is allowed to speed 20kph over the limit to overtake, I can just see the M4 now. Scenario 4. The proper thing to do. You leave earlier, allow for traffic, and wait til its either safe to overtake and when the opportunity arises to overtake do it safely, legally and courteously. Yes it is frustrating and to be honest I accept it can be a real pain in the $%#@. But lets face it, it is the right thing to do.

No, in my scenario you don't get 20 people banked up.

But going back to post the opening post, to pass legally and safely I need to see if there is a car coming from the other way over 7 km up the road.

[OwnTheRoad]

I have just spent the last 7 weeks touring this great country ,central and eastern parts towing a van and yes the speeding and overtaking scenario occurred many times , I travelled at 95 klm P/h ,my speedo is 100 % spot On @100 so many folk behind seemed happy with my progress , the ops calcs when applied to a road train travellIng @ 90 klms p/h make things even more difficult for sure , I certainly sped to pass people it's the only safe way and over 600 klm journeys 10 is faster makes a difference to both travel times and fuel consumption .
Any for anyone who intends on doing outback travel I strongly recommend you have a UHF unit installed or good quality portable as it makes overtaking and being overtaken a great way to do it safely , our truckies are fantastic and were always keen to help , and if you travel mining roads being able to hear the pilot vehicle drivers call out the load width of their oversize loads behind was just brilliant too .
Drive safe folks hooroo

[The Snout]

If in doubt, plant the foot and pull out.

[302 XC]

Originally Posted by The Snout

If in doubt, plant the foot and pull out.

The issue with a statement like this is, most cant plant the foot and pull out successfully
Ive had a wee wee hyundai try overtake me in a truck and trailer
Couldnt get past the front door,something about hammer time and a 9 metre vehicle you have to pass at 100Ks
I think many who cant judge speed, distance,should hand their licence back
driving a car isnt all about sitting on the limit and indicating to make a turn

Most couldnt successfully drive a stick up the preverbial

[XRDeeze]

Originally Posted by 302 XC

The issue with a statement like this is, most cant plant the foot and pull out successfully
Ive had a wee wee hyundai try overtake me in a truck and trailer
Couldnt get past the front door,something about hammer time and a 9 metre vehicle you have to pass at 100Ks
I think many who cant judge speed, distance,should hand their licence back
driving a car isnt all about sitting on the limit and indicating to make a turn

Most couldnt successfully drive a stick up the preverbial

Don't worry, just Azonto..

[H.G]

whaa whaa whaa.. just because your on the road.. doesnt mean its all about YOU.

[Kable72]

Originally Posted by H.G

whaa whaa whaa.. just because your on the road.. doesnt mean its all about YOU.

And once again, you miss the point of the entire thread. Well done /golfclap

[tweeked]

Originally Posted by H.G

whaa whaa whaa.. just because your on the road.. doesnt mean its all about YOU.

Yep, it is about everyone on the road.

[OzJavelin]

Deliberately took the motorbike on a trip last weekend even though I know it's a boring ride .. because I also know that stretch of regional road is notorious for slower drivers bunching up and ending up with huge tailbacks. I find the bike is a LOT easier to pass individual cars at slower speeds, rather than a car which basically must try and pass a whole line of cars before they can find a spot to pull back in. As it was my fears were unfounded and it was an easy ride!

[H.G]

yes dear..

[AndrewR_AUII]

Interesting thread with Bathurst coming up....the trip home is usually....interesting.