Chinese cars make record sales in Australia

[LG17]

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

Damn, that's a good-looking thing and 1/3 price of a T3?

Real sports cars don't have a roof...

[FairmontGS]

Originally Posted by LG17

Real sports cars don't have a roof...

Hmmm. I'm more like "convertibles are just coupes, ruined"

[Syndrome]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

https://www.caradvice.com.au/909912/...-record-sales/

Interesting given the trade war we're currently involved in with China, it shows that people don't particularly care about the politics of it all, they're just shopping for best value.

Best value? No. Cheapest price.

There is a difference between value and price.

[oldel]

I probably would never buy a Chinese car - not just for their politics but because I'm old and like old things LOL. I'm living in the past and I'll die that way because I don't care for modern tech. (this is typed up on a 10 y/o desktop and my mobile phone is some cheap junk mostly unused and probably switched off)

But I think the comment before wasn't about Thai rangers or imported cars, it's more the fact that manufacturers have moved to China and they're making most car's components now. For example ZF/lemforder as a name brand, but heaps of minor pieces on cars are all made in China now.

Companies get annoyed at consumers buying cheap junk direct from overseas - hurts their profits - buy local they say and support jobs. But junk is made in China in the first place because companies shut down manufacture in the west (losing jobs), in order to increase their profits by making goods over there at a cheaper cost in the first bloody place.

[Franco Cozzo]

Two young girls in their early 20s both have those MG3 things around the corner from me, they're a cheap entry level rig with some technology behind it.

I haven't seen any of the SUVs but I've seen a couple of the MG3s getting about.

I could be tempted to buy into the brand if they had an engine with some balls under the hood, my Focus is getting on and is getting a bit long in the tooth but its hard to find something in that mid $20K price range with some balls like my modified diesel Focus and that's good on fuel for a daily.

[Ben73]

What kind of self respecting person buys a Chinese car. Spend a few extra grand and buy a South Korean car.
At least you are buying from a country that doesn't hate you and all western values.

I would assume the average person wouldn't know where their car is from and doesn't care. I would also assume every single thing they buy is the cheapest version of that particular product.

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by Ben73

What kind of self respecting person buys a Chinese car. Spend a few extra grand and buy a South Korean car.
At least you are buying from a country that doesn't hate you and all western values.

I would assume the average person wouldn't know where their car is from and doesn't care. I would also assume every single thing they buy is the cheapest version of that particular product.

Your last line answered the question from your first line

[oldel]

By the time electric cars are commonplace and affordable I bet they're mostly chinese made. Not many trust their mechanicals, but the western world's corporations made them the global electronics/electrical powerhouse already.
Apparently selling phones for over $1k with cheap components didn't leave enough profit for apple and google to make them in the US despite USA's low wages and high manufacturing capability. They, and many other companies, would rather give away IP and support the Chinese regime than have local jobs. We treat them as the worlds factory and wonder why they treat us as merely 'the dirt farmers' and not as a fair and equal trading partner. The hole we've dug leaves us as serving them as subordinates.

[yanknbank]

No one but no one, should be buying ANYTHING from China at the moment with what’s going on across the planet, let alone buying cars. The CCP? Duplicitous arseholes.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by yanknbank

No one but no one, should be buying ANYTHING from China at the moment with what’s going on across the planet, let alone buying cars. The CCP? Duplicitous arseholes.

I agree but most Australians don't care, they buy on price. We make good quality **** but everyone's like I can get it for $2 on eBay.

Regardless we can do one offs and turn it around within a few days, China eBay special costs SFA.

I'm a sales scumbag in our manufacturing industry based in Melbourne - pray for Franco 🙏

#doingtheLordswork

[39ClevoUte]

If you sell billions of $ of raw material to someone......what are you going to do with their cash?

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by 37Clevo

If you sell billions of $ of raw material to someone......what are you going to do with their cash?

Nose beers and ladies of poor virtue

[Syndrome]

Price - when two items for sale are identical then price is the main point. Why pay more for the same product which can be purchased for less?

Quality - when two similar items are for sale but the better one costs more because it is superior quality.

Value - when the decision needs to be made on whether the buyer is satisfied with the inferior version, or they see value in paying more for the premium version.

I do not see Chinese cars as good value a the moment. They are cheaper than their Japanese, Korean or Thai assembled competitors. However I'd rather pay extra to get the better quality car.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Syndrome

Price - when two items for sale are identical then price is the main point. Why pay more for the same product which can be purchased for less?

Quality - when two similar items are for sale but the better one costs more because it is superior quality.

Value - when the decision needs to be made on whether the buyer is satisfied with the inferior version, or they see value in paying more for the premium version.

I do not see Chinese cars as good value a the moment. They are cheaper than their Japanese, Korean or Thai assembled competitors. However I'd rather pay extra to get the better quality car.

If you're going to keep it for a long time then parts availability is crucial too - try get parts for a Great Wall V240 ute or what ever they were a decade ago.

I just crapped out the starter motor on my Focus tonight, 10+ in stock around the corner from work, only $350 too.

[danzvtil]

I test drove 2 MGs today for fun, an MG3 and ZS. Sales guy was telling me they are out of base ZS (1.5 4 cyl) until feb/mar. I guess $21990 DA is too good to pass up. Dealer was busy too.
To drive, they weren’t horrible either.

[Crazy Dazz]

So take out MG and the rest amounts to SFA.

I seem to recall MG advertising that was something along the lines of "The RETURN of an Icon.". So yes, very deceptive.

**** the Chinese.

I'm looking forward to the day their pride backs them into a war with the USA.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

So take out MG and the rest amounts to SFA.

I seem to recall MG advertising that was something along the lines of "The RETURN of an Icon.". So yes, very deceptive.

**** the Chinese.

I'm looking forward to the day their pride backs them into a war with the USA.

You need to differentiate between 'China/Chinese' and their government, the CCP.

Your average Chinese bloke just wants shelter, food, an income and a better life for their crotch spawn.

They're not pushing for trade wars, trying to undermine Australia's sovereignty and being a pack of bastards, it's their government - the CCP.

One country, two very different groups of people, if we keep conflating the two eventually the innocent Chinese community here in Australia will be on the receiving end of an attack and that's exactly what the CCP wants and a perfect anti Australian propaganda campaign opportunity would be gifted to them.

I'm all for anti CCP rhetoric but the last thing we want to happen is USA and China coming to blows because we're in their backyard and we'll be involved.

With MG being the most successful Chinese car company in Australia it could be down to a couple factors:

- Iconic brand name (MG)
- Offering a product in the sub $20K price point

In my micro car thread we discuss the lack of options in the sub $20K price point.

I had more options as a 17 year old kid buying a new car in this price point 11 years ago.

While apparently there's no money in that sub $20K price point and established manufacturers are pulling out of it they seem to be forgetting there's a new generation buying cars and an opportunity to snag a long term customer of their brand.

[oldel]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I had more options as a 17 year old kid buying a new car in this price point 11 years ago.

While apparently there's no money in that sub $20K price point and established manufacturers are pulling out of it they seem to be forgetting there's a new generation buying cars and an opportunity to snag a long term customer of their brand.

I noticed you've talked about this before and had that video linked. That woman at the end had that attitude of "kids aren't buying the cheap cars because they feel entitled". Kind of like the real estate agent that blames low numbers of recent gens buying a house on spending their money on avo toast!

Not many young people buy new cars, historically only ones with upper middle class or higher parents that either subsidized it, bought them outright, or got their kids into a good paying job ever bought a new car - even a cheap one.
Most normal younger people spent under $5k and bought s/h.
I don't know any young person who got a new car, I've only seen the rich person buying their kid a BMW or merc for graduation in hollywood movies. Realistically the person who bought a new car was statring a proper well paid career -A full time career with prospects, not a casual gig - were in their mid to late 20s, and a house -not local but far away in a far flung new outer suburb that was worth moving to - cost under $200k.
All that opportunity (career in a secure full time job and affordable housing) has disappeared along with the cheap first new car buyer market.

These days it's even worse, maybe many kids deciding to do without due to draconian laws making it harder to get a licence, making it less useful to even have one (curfews on passengers), harder to keep it (extended P plate time with higher fines and penalties). I know if the cops could impound my car I'd rather be driving a sh!tbox than a new car I paid 20k+ for.

On top of that higher rents or if they are ambitious doing without a car in order to save for a house deposit. Or they live at home longer in an older suburb close to public transport unlike back when young people moved out at 18y/o to the sticks and needed a cheap car.
All that plus if you like playing on your phone like younger people do then PT suits better and the worse place to do it is in your car. But you'd had to have a real pressing interest in cars to put the phone down and many younger people are more interested in social media than spark plugs.

Everyone wants their captive market: manufacturers, gov coffers/looking like doing something (100hr L plates, 3 year probation, higher penalties for P platers, curfews). But eventually a target market switches off and don't want any of that. Houses and rent are too expensive to spend money on a car the gov is only going to penalise you for E: Not to mention insurance rates. If you spend 20K on a new car these days i hope you are willing to pay $5k a year insurance. - Nah, save the fines, save the car loan, save the insurance costs and save up for a house.

I'm not blaming this on manufacturers, they have to price something that as you said, hooks new customers but doesn't lose money. It's not their fault - they removed cheap cars because no one was buying anyway. Due to all the other crap they've removed 'first car ever' to concentrate on 30s and older market ie 'first new family car ever because we're having a baby and need a suv'

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

You need to differentiate between 'China/Chinese' and their government, the CCP.

Why?
**** the lot of them.

And to be honest, if there are Australians stupid enough to identify themselves as "Chinese" because they share a few genetic traits with the Chinese, then **** them too.

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

With MG being the most successful Chinese car company in Australia it could be down to a couple factors:

- Iconic brand name (MG)
- Offering a product in the sub $20K price point

It's both
People like cheap prices, but most are "smart enough" to stay away from cheap unknown brands when it comes to cars.
The irony being that true MGs were notoriously badly built and unreliable, but it's brand recognition.

The new cars were advertised heavily through certain channels, and I must confess that upon seeing their ads my first thought was "Nice, MG is back."
Obviously for me, my literal 2nd thought was "hmm, I wonder who is making them? I hope it's not another iconic British marque sold to the bloody Germans."

Followed by the inevitable horror and outrage, when told it was the Chinese.

Sadly, many people don't get that far.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

Why?
**** the lot of them.

And to be honest, if there are Australians stupid enough to identify themselves as "Chinese" because they share a few genetic traits with the Chinese, then **** them too.

It's both
People like cheap prices, but most are "smart enough" to stay away from cheap unknown brands when it comes to cars.
The irony being that true MGs were notoriously badly built and unreliable, but it's brand recognition.

The new cars were advertised heavily through certain channels, and I must confess that upon seeing their ads my first thought was "Nice, MG is back."
Obviously for me, my literal 2nd thought was "hmm, I wonder who is making them? I hope it's not another iconic British marque sold to the bloody Germans."

Followed by the inevitable horror and outrage, when told it was the Chinese.

Sadly, many people don't get that far.

Because its recognising the difference and acknowledging the issues and problems are being caused by their government (who they don't have a choice in) rather than Chinese people.

The 'average' Chinese person or person of Chinese heritage in Melbourne or Sydney has nothing to do with whats going on with their government back home.

Wrongly targeting these innocent people is a massive own goal and a victory for the CCP - they WANT you to start acting out against our Chinese community in Australia.

Its absolutely ridiculous and ironic that its me who is explaining this concept given I'm probably the least tolerant Millennial (and most typecast as a 'racist') to the short sighted monoculturalism (we're not a 'multicultural' society like thats advertised, see 'ethnic ghetto') that's plagued Melbourne for the past 80+ years and yet I can see what the CCP is trying to achieve here.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Because its recognising the difference and acknowledging the issues and problems are being caused by their government (who they don't have a choice in) rather than Chinese people.

The 'average' Chinese person or person of Chinese heritage in Melbourne or Sydney has nothing to do with whats going on with their government back home.

Wrongly targeting these innocent people is a massive own goal and a victory for the CCP - they WANT you to start acting out against our Chinese community in Australia.

Its absolutely ridiculous and ironic that its me who is explaining this concept given I'm probably the least tolerant Millennial (and most typecast as a 'racist') to the short sighted monoculturalism (we're not a 'multicultural' society like thats advertised, see 'ethnic ghetto') that's plagued Melbourne for the past 80+ years and yet I can see what the CCP is trying to achieve here.

They are brainwashed from birth to serve their masters. They are mostly too far gone to accept as anything other than one and the same as the ccp. They are programmed to never question the ruling party. And if you do, you won’t last long.

The ccp get their tentacles into them deep.

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Because its recognising the difference and acknowledging the issues and problems are being caused by their government (who they don't have a choice in) rather than Chinese people.

The 'average' Chinese person or person of Chinese heritage in Melbourne or Sydney has nothing to do with whats going on with their government back home.

Wrongly targeting these innocent people is a massive own goal and a victory for the CCP - they WANT you to start acting out against our Chinese community in Australia.

Its absolutely ridiculous and ironic that its me who is explaining this concept given I'm probably the least tolerant Millennial (and most typecast as a 'racist') to the short sighted monoculturalism (we're not a 'multicultural' society like thats advertised, see 'ethnic ghetto') that's plagued Melbourne for the past 80+ years and yet I can see what the CCP is trying to achieve here.

Pfft!
What are you on about???

As I said, if an Australian chooses to be identified as Chinese, then **** them too. That's a not a characterisation I make, it's their choice.

As for making a distinction between China, its people, and its rulers, again WTF are you on about???
My house has walls, a roof, and many other components. We all understand that, but I can still refer to them all collectively as "my house."

Obviously anyone with half a brain can make a distinction between an individual and their country. So what?
Do think they're only penalising the Australian farmers who are ****s? But hey we won't tax the Barley grown by Fred cos he's a Good bloke??

Nah, **** the Chinese, and **** the pos Great Wally ute they road in on.

[Ben73]

Probably helps that CarAdvice is going to be renamed to MGadvice.com soon with the amount they’re trying to push it down the readers throats

[Franco Cozzo]

I'm certainly not from 'upper middle class' or 'rich', I just landed a job at 15 and managed to save up a ****load by the time I was 17

I don't think it's that uncommon to see young kids/adults getting around in nice cars around Melbourne.

Maybe it's on the hook for finance, maybe they're just doing what I did, or as you say have parents with some money behind them.

Maybe younger millennials (millennials at their oldest are nearly 40) and Gen Z prefer to travel rather than spend money on expensive things like cars (pre COVID shenanigans), they go to universities and rent in the inner suburbs close to public transport to get to and from school.

I'm noticing a trend from the younger employees where I work, the professional ones in the office won't consider work that's not located near public transport or that's in outer metropolitan suburbs due to requiring cars.

Same with where they live, they're choosing to live in inner suburbia or the CBD and won't consider outside of a 10KM radius of the CBD.

It would be interesting to compare the spending habits of regional millennials and Gen Z compared to their metropolitan counterparts.

I suspect the ones staying out regional will have cars and nicer ones than their metropolitan counterparts.

Asking our resident millennials or Gen Z here (do we even have Gen Z members?) probably would return skewed results, we're on a car enthusiast forum.

Our resident Boomers and Gen X, be interesting to see what your (non car enthusiast) kids think

[oldel]

If you didn't work so hard maybe your first car could have been a second hand under $2k 1970s sh!tbox worth heaps right now
My first car was a $1400 RX3 and I don't regret owning it, but do regret getting rid of it.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by oldel

If you didn't work so hard maybe your first car could have been a second hand under $2k 1970s sh!tbox worth heaps right now
My first car was a $1400 RX3 and I don't regret owning it, but do regret getting rid of it.

I should have bought a VN/VP SS or the R34 Skyline I was looking at

1990s JDM is drug money now

[Sprintey]

Hi all, hope you are having a good holiday and enjoyed Christmas.

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I should have bought a VN/VP SS or the R34 Skyline I was looking at

1990s JDM is drug money now

Yes, you should have. If the JDM is now drug money, you will have to go get the SS. Also, go original, I know you love to improve them Franco (and have the skills), but the original ones appreciate better. 90's price appreciation is the sweetest of the lot. It's extra ripe. Btw, saw a nice VS Statesman today, part of the huge migration down to the coast.

Originally Posted by oldel

I noticed you've talked about this before and had that video linked. That woman at the end had that attitude of "kids aren't buying the cheap cars because they feel entitled". Kind of like the real estate agent that blames low numbers of recent gens buying a house on spending their money on avo toast!

Not many young people buy new cars, historically only ones with upper middle class or higher parents that either subsidized it, bought them outright, or got their kids into a good paying job ever bought a new car - even a cheap one.
Most normal younger people spent under $5k and bought s/h.
I don't know any young person who got a new car, I've only seen the rich person buying their kid a BMW or merc for graduation in hollywood movies. Realistically the person who bought a new car was statring a proper well paid career -A full time career with prospects, not a casual gig - were in their mid to late 20s, and a house -not local but far away in a far flung new outer suburb that was worth moving to - cost under $200k.
All that opportunity (career in a secure full time job and affordable housing) has disappeared along with the cheap first new car buyer market.

These days it's even worse, maybe many kids deciding to do without due to draconian laws making it harder to get a licence, making it less useful to even have one (curfews on passengers), harder to keep it (extended P plate time with higher fines and penalties). I know if the cops could impound my car I'd rather be driving a sh!tbox than a new car I paid 20k+ for.

On top of that higher rents or if they are ambitious doing without a car in order to save for a house deposit. Or they live at home longer in an older suburb close to public transport unlike back when young people moved out at 18y/o to the sticks and needed a cheap car.
All that plus if you like playing on your phone like younger people do then PT suits better and the worse place to do it is in your car. But you'd had to have a real pressing interest in cars to put the phone down and many younger people are more interested in social media than spark plugs.

Everyone wants their captive market: manufacturers, gov coffers/looking like doing something (100hr L plates, 3 year probation, higher penalties for P platers, curfews). But eventually a target market switches off and don't want any of that. Houses and rent are too expensive to spend money on a car the gov is only going to penalise you for E: Not to mention insurance rates. If you spend 20K on a new car these days i hope you are willing to pay $5k a year insurance. - Nah, save the fines, save the car loan, save the insurance costs and save up for a house.

I'm not blaming this on manufacturers, they have to price something that as you said, hooks new customers but doesn't lose money. It's not their fault - they removed cheap cars because no one was buying anyway. Due to all the other crap they've removed 'first car ever' to concentrate on 30s and older market ie 'first new family car ever because we're having a baby and need a suv'

Really good post and I'd say true for our kids and their friends. Where did Australia's cheap, quality life go?

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I'm certainly not from 'upper middle class' or 'rich', I just landed a job at 15 and managed to save up a ****load by the time I was 17

I don't think it's that uncommon to see young kids/adults getting around in nice cars around Melbourne.

Maybe it's on the hook for finance, maybe they're just doing what I did, or as you say have parents with some money behind them.

Maybe younger millennials (millennials at their oldest are nearly 40) and Gen Z prefer to travel rather than spend money on expensive things like cars (pre COVID shenanigans), they go to universities and rent in the inner suburbs close to public transport to get to and from school.

I'm noticing a trend from the younger employees where I work, the professional ones in the office won't consider work that's not located near public transport or that's in outer metropolitan suburbs due to requiring cars.

Same with where they live, they're choosing to live in inner suburbia or the CBD and won't consider outside of a 10KM radius of the CBD.

It would be interesting to compare the spending habits of regional millennials and Gen Z compared to their metropolitan counterparts.

I suspect the ones staying out regional will have cars and nicer ones than their metropolitan counterparts.

Asking our resident millennials or Gen Z here (do we even have Gen Z members?) probably would return skewed results, we're on a car enthusiast forum.

Our resident Boomers and Gen X, be interesting to see what your (non car enthusiast) kids think

Resident X here describing regional Gen Z kids thoughts: eldest hasn't got a licence yet, sees cars as a massive waste of money. Type 1 also hindered, and when added to all the cost bullsh.. so licence wasn't got. The amount of lifts bribed off friends, siblings, and parents over the last few years has been phenomenal - you really do need a car if you want to be independent out here. Uni sucked in winter as it was a connecting bus trip and sometimes eldest would just walk a suburb as that was easier. Not fun.

A move to another city and finishing uni is on the cards, so a licence is a 2021 goal. Wants manual, like youngest got. So I will service the ED and manual V8 it will be for Ls, and that should be fun. I like how they both have been adamant they will learn a manual. Eldest is not a city fan (neither are tbh) - regards Melbourne as the 7th level of hell. Is happy to spend big on interests, which cars aren't. Not even electric or connectivity can create an interest in cars. Saved and spent big on Euro travel, rued missing a snow season and copping a summer heatwave there, is determined to spend next spare money purely on snowboarding. If eldest gets a car, they are open to something reliable and is prepared for extra fuel cost to forego expensive repairs. As eldest loves memes, I suggested an AU, the most meme-able vehicle in the universe. (Partly a joke: I'd want as recent crash protection as possible for them)

Youngest got manual licence, then got an auto FG XR6 with lux pack interior. It's a seriously nice car. Immediately, 30-something women in professional atire were eyeing youngest off. Friend group got a variety of cars, and after their transmissions died (Cruze, Mazda 6) or they rolled it (Hilux) or their engines broke down (Alfa!) or they crashed it (Commodore ute) - the friends gravitated to FGs. One friend bought a new Suby, and remarked that the interior of youngest's FG was on par with the new car. Youngest's thoughts on the car: likes it and likes the freedom it gives to hang out, get to work, go to parties, sleep over (in it at times - comfy back seat), take surfboards, take snowboards, travel up to snow. Costs are high, but this is seen as being Australia. The bus just wouldn't be an alternative at all. My advice was to buy one very good car in good condition with what you need/like, don't modify it and keep it well until needs change (ie family, or a ute for a trade) - rather than swapping them round and fixing them up often. Youngest thinks the FG will hold its value and eventually go up, and it already has during corona and with Aussie cars no longer being produced.

[oldel]

Also to add there were no speed camera back then, I got my licence after 3 lessons and a driving test just going around the block, P plate period was 1 year, I had 6 points before loss of licence, fines were lower, no impounding. IE it was fun and easy to drive.
Now it's not. Like I said before the new entry market is catering to 30 year olds that need a SUV because they want something safe and new because they're having a baby.

It doesn't seem like fun any more to be young and buy your first car as a 19 year old, plus their interests are online which isn't compatible.


E: My youngest brother is a millenial. He got my hand me down cars when he was young - I used to buy any 808 or 929 I could find cheap in order to have cheap glass and panels for my RX3 and RX4 and he just drove those older piston engined mazdas.
Then he got my dual fuel EA falcon after I was done with it on my around australia trips. When I took them all away he did the camry and VW thing like n00bs do but he never really cared about cars; often didn't have one as he worked in mining, spent a million on real estate and doubled his money, then overseas round the world trips and moving to London.

Now he's spending all his money trying to escape London with his family due to covid. He's never really cared for cars but I guess he was lucky because he could borrow one on my spares? His camry and his VW were both unreliable too so that put him off cars entirely.

E2: But it's plain to see the best thing he ever did was not care about or spend any money on cars when he was young. I think most younger people have also figured that out too, especially with all the downsides I have mentioned that governments brought in to punish young drivers.

[Syndrome]

I remember the term JAPCRAP used a lot when I was a kid. The Koreans and the Chinese are lucky as I don't believe KORCRAP or CHINCRAP will ever be used.

[Yellow_Festiva]

I was wondering what took them so long? I wonder how many unique parts for other manufacturers does China make? Must be in the hundreds of thousands?!?

How long did it take someone to say? Hang on, we are making all these parts - lets learn from all the RD others have done and adapt it for our own cars!

The MG3 is the modern day bubble Hyundai Excel - not because it was cheap and cheerful, but because it got people into a NEW car for the first time that wasn't a tiny city run about.

I bet they are still making money on those at $16.5k DA as well.

I do see a lot of them around actually - and they appear to be well optioned, even for the base model, and not bad to look at as well.

Another thing to add - I wonder if this has pumped some fresh, younger blood into the car clubs?

I'm a member of the Fiat club and there is a ton of the modern day models on the register. Did that happen with Citroen and Renault etc when became popular again here?