It's official - 6.0L Holden Commodores

[Polyal]

I think the doomsday people might want to hold their tongues for a bit.

No one has heard about this engine until today and now Ford is stuffed? Its got 264kws, so does the BOSS, 4kw's is going to mean stuff all when he commy is still down 2 gears. Unless they drop 4.11's in, which I wouldn't ut past them but that will stuff up there fuel consumption figures (which they BS about anyway).

In stock form the LS1 is not great, the LS2 is awesome. But until the LS2 finds its way into a SS I am not worried at all.

This is a move that holden have been forced into, I wouldn't be suprised if VE was meant to come out alot sooner so they would have a euro3 car and a new model in one hit; but hey, stuff happens.

What cars/trucks is this engine in currently? Maybe we should be reading reviews about those cars before jumping to conclusions.

[MITCHAY]

264kws VS 260kws isnt much power difference. I think the key factor is weight and transmission. No doubt the VE will be beefier than the VZ but whether or not it is heavier than the BF still remains to be seen.

I can't remember if this is correct or not but havent Holden opted for a revised front suspension and a different rear suspension set up on the VE which would keep weight increase down? I vaguely recall reading something along those lines somewhere. Wasn't the suspension upgrade a major part of the weight increase with the BA?

[pandaman]

I can't say I'm a fan of the whole "just add cubes" philosophy. If this does turn out to be true, it will be intersesting to see how the fuel economy goes for them, especially if they stick with the current drivetrain. There is no doubt that this thing will be fast in a straight line (As per usual :-P), but it was mentioned earlier in the thread that this may be a cast iron block? if it is this could be have interesting effects on weight and handling.

Resale value, hmmm, it won't really matter that it is a different 6 litre to the HSV engine I reckon, all the average punter is gonna see is that they both have a 6.0 some damn thing or another under the hood. I mean think about it, how many holden fans realise that the 5.7 genIII/ls1 isn't 350 cubic inches? So, one six litre or another whats the difference to the average fool?

[ray38l]

I know alot of people wont like the engine because its in a holden but it really is a good engine.
The facts that i know so far is that its a alloy block,the engine is lighter then a LS1 and LS2, its designed to run a six speed gearbox and it comes from the same engine family as the LS1/LS2. It also uses the same computer as the LS1 so LS1edit will work on it.
Who needs quad cam engines when pushrods make more power and are more reliable.

[CSV_LS1]

I'm guessing the heads of the Boss is what's killing the low rpm power with it's high flowness. If Ford US developed Variable Valve Timing for the engine it would be a big step. I may be wrong though.

[billyb35]

And how exactly is a 6 litre Commodore a viable option? Think of the fuel consumption. in hell.

[OLS108]

LOL u guys are so funny , If ford were to release a 6.0Lt V8 you would all be talking about How Great it is. come on guys Grow up, its a Good engine as is the Boss asfor the Trans it too will have a 6speed auto possibly even the ZF !!!!!!

[T3ts50]

Originally Posted by OLS108

LOL u guys are so funny , If ford were to release a 6.0Lt V8 you would all be talking about How Great it is. come on guys Grow up, its a Good engine as is the Boss asfor the Trans it too will have a 6speed auto possibly even the ZF !!!!!!

I has been pretty much confirmed that they wont use the ZF. They will be using the GM six speeder used in the Caddy STS-V abd XLR-V.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by OLS108

LOL u guys are so funny , If ford were to release a 6.0Lt V8 you would all be talking about How Great it is. come on guys Grow up, its a Good engine as is the Boss asfor the Trans it too will have a 6speed auto possibly even the ZF !!!!!!

lol no you are wrong there. In FPV's and HSV's I dont care if they throw V10's in there, but for the bread and butter stuff (SS) 6.0L is getting stupid. Times have changed and GM is a dinosaur and reluctant to change its old way of thinking. Ford isn't much better but does take on new technology quicker than holden.

And who the hell keeps on saying GM will use ZF...thats the biggest load of bull ive read in ages, they have already developed their own 6 speed...lol

I hope one day that Ford Aus get the jag engines! small they might be but they are good on fuel and make the right power. GMH have a mines bigger than your attitude, and unfortunatley the monkeys fall for it.

But with fuel going the way it is, GMH woudl want to make sure it doesn't use anymore than what the LS1 does or they will cop some flack.

[jonbays]

This is all dinosaur stuff really who cares about OHV V8's when the real go is a turbocharged DOHC VCT Six.

Yes they do SOUND great but unless you are into 70's muscle cars the days are numbered for Big V8's.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

264kws VS 260kws isnt much power difference. I think the key factor is weight and transmission. No doubt the VE will be beefier than the VZ but whether or not it is heavier than the BF still remains to be seen.

I can't remember if this is correct or not but havent Holden opted for a revised front suspension and a different rear suspension set up on the VE which would keep weight increase down? I vaguely recall reading something along those lines somewhere. Wasn't the suspension upgrade a major part of the weight increase with the BA?

You've got it the wrong way round. The Control Blade IRS on the BA was 20kg lighter than the AU IRS, and the VE's new IRS is supposed to be extrememly complex, heavy and expensive to make.

[AUIII XR8 MAN]

Originally Posted by Polyal

GMH have a mines bigger than your attitude, and unfortunatley the monkeys fall for it.

But with fuel going the way it is, GMH woudl want to make sure it doesn't use anymore than what the LS1 does or they will cop some flack.

You got that right.
A mate on mine has a LS2 & it uses less fuel than his old LS1 did. So i say this one will be go on fuel aswell.

It will take alot of convincing to tell a buyer that they would get great fuel economy out of a 6.0l V8. HSV sales are still ordinary even though the 6.0l is meant to be the ducks guts.

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by RATT

It will take alot of convincing to tell a buyer that they would get great fuel economy out of a 6.0l V8. HSV sales are still ordinary even though the 6.0l is meant to be the ducks guts.

.3L isnt really going to make that bigger difference - the new 380 has .3 more than the old 3.5L Magna - same sort of fuel economy - it depends on fuel mapping, the ecu etc. Anyway, the 6.0L is supposed to have displacement on demand.

Yes it's only 0.3l but it's hit 6 litres!

[SSBUB]

i guess they MAY have to try and market how good the 6l is on fuel. But i cant see them doing that.

[jonbays]

Market a Six litre V8 on economy?

No you have to be kidding when a 1.3 litre car will carry 4 people anywhere and everywhere at the legal limits with economy.

Six litre V8 it's all about power and having more than everyone else. Oh and yes having all this power need not cost as much as it used to at the petrol pump.

[CSV_LS1]

The boss isn't exactly easy on fuel is it? I doubt it will be any more than the boss. Possibly less.

[clontarf_x]

Most V8's eat fuel. Anyone with a brain knows that.
So really the 6.0L will be purely for power and the new E3 Regulations.

I think you'd probably find Holden have made the E3 step because they had to; if they didn't they cant sell their cars here!

I say good on em for making a more powerful engine. Sure it didn't need to be 6 freakin litres but if thats the only way they can do then then oh well not our problem is it :P

[Franky]

I've always wondered what people would think if only FPV would increase their power to 300kw, would it make much difference to anyone considering to buy one?

In the real world probably not but 6.0L V8 looks better on paper than 5.7L V8 and that's pretty much the bottom line. Holden had to update their engines and unlike Ford they decided to also up their power there is nothing suprising about it really, as usual a good call.

[Psycho Chicken]

Seriously, who buys an SS or an XR8 for fuel economy?

[gtfpv]

my 2c . if people like a v8 . then they will like a 6 litre . now it will be 6 litre versus 5.4. so any hsv die hard who considers buying a xr8 or gt will find it a little harder to make the decision . 2ndly holden will not lose a power war . that is against thier marketing tactic. 3rdly if it wasn't for holden then ford wouldn't try to improve thier engines as they have with ba due to massive sales losses with au . 4thly the new engine will be better in tech as all new cars improve and move forward. i feel a bit sorry for anyone who buys a holden because every year or 2 they come out with a differant engine which makes them redundant in the stakes against themselves.but blah blah blah yarda yarda yarda it sells. and i still like holdens . i just happen to like fords better. 7 years ago this marketing philosophy walked all over ford .these days ford are competitive with a smaller engine and plenty of room to move with it.
it will be interesting to see how history rates the BF's life seeing it will be short lived . like the ED. as we can see marketing times have windows and ford have differant philosiphees. the BF will live the life of a holden in its term.

[EBII Fairmont]

I think it is strating to go a bit over the top. I can see a repeat of the 70's when Ford were building the GTHO Phase 4. Plus I'd rather have a car which can perform well on a windy road, than a car which is quicker in a straight line. For instance, my neighbour bout a 2003 bmw 330. Now, i don't believe a Ford or Holden could do what this does on a windy road.

I believe overall performance of a car, is way better than having a car, which you can turn around and say, "I can do high 9's in a quarter" and when it comes to true driving the car can't performe that well. It is not a great accomplishment to be able to have high capacity speed. Plus therange in kw difference is so minor, that both cars are at the end of the day going to be very close in a drag.

bill

[Bluehoon]

Holen has gone backwards 30 years...

6 litre is silly...

All these motors they are importing is all the rubbish from the states.

Holden is not using any technology to get any better with their engines.

Big is not better look at the XR6T, 6 cylinders and a V8 muncher....

desperate marketing attempt from Holden, IMO.....

[T3rminator]

Originally Posted by jonbays

This is all dinosaur stuff really who cares about OHV V8's when the real go is a turbocharged DOHC VCT Six.
Yes they do SOUND great but unless you are into 70's muscle cars the days are numbered for Big V8's.

You can always turbo the V8s but the 6s will always be missing 2 cylinders

As for the 6L SS.....I'd be tempted to get one. But first lets just see what the package does.

[ratter]

Originally Posted by Bluehoon

Holen has gone backwards 30 years...

6 litre is silly...

All these motors they are importing is all the rubbish from the states.

Holden is not using any technology to get any better with their engines.

Big is not better look at the XR6T, 6 cylinders and a V8 muncher....

desperate marketing attempt from Holden, IMO.....

Maybe they don't need all the technology at the momment, if they pass euro3 they are good enough for present time.

They obviuosly have modern enough ways to pass emission tests without using some of the other technology available and still make good power.

Imagine how well they good do if they started using OHC, multivalves, variable valve timing etc.

[Bluehoon]

Originally Posted by ratter

Maybe they don't need all the technology at the momment, if they pass euro3 they are good enough for present time.

They obviuosly have modern enough ways to pass emission tests without using some of the other technology available and still make good power.

Imagine how well they good do if they started using OHC, multivalves, variable valve timing etc.

Doubt it. Holden being holden will go to Toyota and buy another motor.
As they were lacking intellect to figure out VCT, OHC, for themselves :

[ratter]

Originally Posted by Bluehoon

Doubt it. Holden being holden will go to Toyota and buy another motor.
As they were lacking intellect to figure out VCT, OHC, for themselves :

Maybe they could employ you

[ea007]

why are we wasting time wondering lets just wait and see what happens as far as i am concerned holden can give away free hookers with there cars I still aint gonna buy it if it dont have the blue oval

[Bluehoon]

Ford / FPV GT-HO has landed...

6 cylinders...

Go the F6!!!!!!!!!!