Should the Falcon I4T have a different name / look different?

[Luke Plaizier]

Think of it this way:

(1) Ford could have jacked up a Falcon Wagon, whacked 4WD under it and tried to sell it. History shows that the Territory, because it was sufficiently different, sold way better than the equivalent jacked-up-Holden-Commodore-Wagon.

(2) Toyota had been trying to sell a car known to be a small/mid 4 Cylinder car with a V6 in it for quite some time without much success. When they split the same car in two - Camry vs Aurion (I'll conveniently side-step the Avalon) - it confused the average punter into thinking they were different cars and received a much greater reception from buyers.

So when Ford bolt a I4T into the Falcon, should the car have a different name or look different?


Lukeyson

[Dave R]

It will still cannibalise Falcon sales, but a new nameplate may also lure in new buyers, just like the Falcon-Territory relationship. They'd have to really convince people that they are different cars, or else people will just see it as a 4cyl Falcon with a fancy name. The majority of people I've spoken to don't have a clue that Aurion is based on Camry and this is what Ford would need to achieve. But, Ford being Ford, the most they'd do is dress it in pretty badges and call it a day.

Then again if they market it under a different name, Ford can't boast about Falcon's fuel economy like Holden will be doing with Commodore. People might also see it as a 'lesser' Falcon.

[KW XRT]

Originally Posted by Adrenaline

It will still cannibalise Falcon sales, but a new nameplate may also lure in new buyers, just like the Falcon-Territory relationship. They'd have to really convince people that they are different cars, or else people will just see it as a 4cyl Falcon with a fancy name. The majority of people I've spoken to don't have a clue that Aurion is based on Camry and this is what Ford would need to achieve. But, Ford being Ford, the most they'd do is dress it in pretty badges and call it a day.

Then again if they market it under a different name, Ford can't boast about Falcon's fuel economy like Holden will be doing with Commodore. People might also see it as a 'lesser' Falcon.

Yep I agree but like terrotory as good as it is {anyone want to swap XR6T for 1 seperating the names has hurt Ford more than I think they realise had terrotory been named falcon hi wagon {for want of a better name it would have contributed to falcon sales and I feel the comparo figures would be heaps better.

[Polyal]

Nothing should be different other than a little econoboost (whatever its called) badge.

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Nothing should be different other than a little econoboost (whatever its called) badge.

Exactly.
It is still a Falcon, they don't want to confuse the buying public any further. Having a 4 cylinder is already info overload most.

[Road_Warrior]

If you give it different looks/name, then what is the point of having the Mondeo?

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

If you give it different looks/name, then what is the point of having the Mondeo?

Id be surprised if the mondeo is around when the I4T comes in, whats the point. All ford need to do is offer a better wagon.

[Luke Plaizier]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

If you give it different looks/name, then what is the point of having the Mondeo?

That is a brilliant question. Should it be dropped completely?

Or, better still, could they stop importing the Mondeo, and sell the 4Cyl Falcon as a Mondeo?

It's not the first time we've seen a badge change cars. The Barina name moved from a Suzuki to an Opel in the Holden range. Why not move the Mondeo name, sell more locally built cars, and save the cost of importing?


Lukeyson

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

That is a brilliant question. Should it be dropped completely?

Or, better still, could they stop importing the Mondeo, and sell the 4Cyl Falcon as a Mondeo?

It's not the first time we've seen a badge change cars. The Barina name moved from a Suzuki to an Opel in the Holden range. Why not move the Mondeo name, sell more locally built cars, and save the cost of importing?


Lukeyson

Given the build quality, content levels and tech of the Mondeo, dropping that car would be stupid. It just needs to be marketed more. FoA can only dream of giving the Falcon the same levels of kit and build quality as the Mondeo.

Not to mention the fact that FoA has access to all the ULEV powertrain options that the european version has, both current and planned. Why cut yourself off from that massive R&D source and access to green powertrains all for a 4 cylinder Falcon in a tiny market?

[Mr Hardware]

I don't like either of the options.

[Dave R]

*ecoboost. I prefer the first name ("Twinforce") before they axed in it favour of an enviro name.

[Luke Plaizier]

How about other reasons:

(1) By putting the I4T into a different market segment, this '4Cyl Falcon' gets to compete in more than one segment in Car of the Year comparisons. I mean, how can the Camry compete in Mid-size and Aurion in Large car when they have the same dimensions but different engines? The Honda Accord/Accord Euro is similar. Based on this, you'd have thought the V8 Falcons/Commodres would be in their own category too.

(2) I've already heard gloating comments from Holden fans regarding a 4-Pot Falcon. This probably comes from their attrocious 4-cyl experience in the VB Commodore. But if this new car is not called a Falcon, would that go some way to hosing off the voracity of their claim?


Lukeyson

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

(2) I've already heard gloating comments from Holden fans regarding a 4-Pot Falcon. This probably comes from their attrocious 4-cyl experience in the VB Commodore. But if this new car is not called a Falcon, would that go some way to hosing off the voracity of their claim?
Lukeyson

And when/if this T4 shows itself to outperform the V6 commodore do you think the gloating will be coming from the same people?

I have a N/A 3.5 litre V6 that in last years PCOTY matched a 6.2 litre GTS around wakefield even though the 3.5 was brand new and tighter than a LPG zealot.

Size only matters when you don't know how to use it.....

[Watto_Cobra]

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

(2) I've already heard gloating comments from Holden fans regarding a 4-Pot Falcon. This probably comes from their attrocious 4-cyl experience in the VB Commodore. But if this new car is not called a Falcon, would that go some way to hosing off the voracity of their claim?


Lukeyson

I suspect the turbo 4 will whip the 3.0L and change their tune.

[FGII-XR6]

althougf I had reservations about the 4 at first this looks like being a 4 with more. it will have similar power to the late e series 6 so it will be no slouch.
the holden 4 banger on the other hand was just a 6 with 2 pots cut off , it was harsh and gutless needing special engine mounts to cope with the vibration and is something I'm sure holden wish they could forget ever happened, worst thing an engineer could put on their CV is worked on development of the holden starfire 4

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

I've already heard gloating comments from Holden fans regarding a 4-Pot Falcon. This probably comes from their attrocious 4-cyl experience in the VB Commodore. But if this new car is not called a Falcon, would that go some way to hosing off the voracity of their claim?


Lukeyson

[Road_Warrior]

Screw what Holden and their followers think about the turbo 4 - obviously they're not the target market and would never buy a Ford anyway.

You could give the car different front and rear bumpers and headlights to give it a different look, a-la Aurion, and call it something like the Taurus (hurrr hurrr) but it still doesn't solve the problem of how it would sit with Mondeo in the lineup.

[Polyal]

Well this is probably way off topic now, but the next falcon should run a business case just like the C class benz and 5 series.

What body style would you like? Wagon, sedan, ute?

What engine? I4T, I6, I6T, I6-LPG, I6 Diesel

What transmission? Manual or auto on all models

From there you just choose what level spec (low, mid, high) and your done. This model would only work if the Falcon (or whatever GWRD) was to be exported properly. No reason other than nervous Americans that should stop it from happening IMO.

[Luke Plaizier]

Sure, but isn't the same I4 engine destined to go into the Mondeo and Focus anyway?

On the other side of the argument, why ship a car halfway across the globe when you can build something almost identical locally?


Lukeyson

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

Sure, but isn't the same I4 engine destined to go into the Mondeo and Focus anyway?

On the other side of the argument, why ship a car halfway across the globe when you can build something almost identical locally?


Lukeyson

I thought it was a 1.6L going in there.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

Sure, but isn't the same I4 engine destined to go into the Mondeo and Focus anyway?

On the other side of the argument, why ship a car halfway across the globe when you can build something almost identical locally?


Lukeyson

The other thing is, by the time this 4 pot 'coon is ready for the market, the Mondeo's EUCD platform will be done with and will have become one C/D car project with the Toreass and Fusion. Assuming Mondeo keeps selling, this car will be coming here.

So there is going to be an even greater economy of scale with the C/D car that the I4T Falcon is going to be competing with. See where I'm going with this?

[Mr Hardware]

Originally Posted by Road Warrior

You could give the car different front and rear bumpers and headlights to give it a different look, a-la Aurion, and call it something like the Taurus (hurrr hurrr) but it still doesn't solve the problem of how it would sit with Mondeo in the lineup.

GOLD!

[bigdude1011]

Why not a Falcon hatch? Either build it in a wagonoid shape (like Corolla/Commodore SportsWagon) or in a liftback shape, (like Mondeo/Mazda6) and undercut the price slightly.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by bigdude1011

Why not a Falcon hatch? Either build it in a wagonoid shape (like Corolla/Commodore SportsWagon) or in a liftback shape, (like Mondeo/Mazda6) and undercut the price slightly.

For the love of God, no.

Nowhere near enough sales volumes there to justify the R&D, tooling and other costs to bring such a car to the market. It's barely there as it is for the wagon which will probably go bye bye next year anyway.

[alter_EGOXR]

hey can i ask a question..will it just be an I4T? or will they have a non turbo, V6, V8 variant too (surely they will) ?

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by hemank

hey can i ask a question..will it just be an I4T? or will they have a non turbo, V6, V8 variant too (surely they will) ?

I4T, I6, I6T and V8. No V6 for the falcon.

[alter_EGOXR]

Originally Posted by vztrt

I4T, I6, I6T and V8. No V6 for the falcon.

Thnx mate...So they are still going to offer the I6 and I6T...i thought they were giving the whole I6 a flick...now thats a relief

[BFZ Wagon]

They could always call it the 'Falconet'? A smaller Falcon is normally known as a Kestrel but that wouldn't work. :P
I'm surprised that no one has released a car in this country with the name 'Southern Cross'. It's not as silly as it sounds. Look at the odd names Holden uses for their vehicles. They replaced the Rodeo name with 'Colorado'. YUK. I don't know why they didn't use a name like 'Nullabor'. They used it years ago when it was a special edition Jackaroo.

I don't see the harm in using the Falcon name with the 4T, 6 and V8 engines. It used to be done years ago with Ford and Holden. At least offering the 3 different engine types, it gives people a choice and it's still a Falcon!
But most probably it would it be known as the 'Falcon EcoBoost'.

P.S. They could always pay homage to the old Forte name and use it like 'FOUR-T' as a name for their I4T? Apologies for that lame attempt at humour. :P

[Yaw]

I don't think they need to change the name at all. An example that has done quite well for itself over the years is The Escape, Available in a 3lt V6 or a 2.4Lt 4 cyl, both have done quite well and did not create confusion.

[mikestp]

It should look different,
we don't want anyone getting them confused with a real falcon

[FalconXV]

Turbo four banger would fit just fine under the current Falcon/G-series/XR umbrella- and have a halo effect on the entire range ( especially an econetic variant). There would be no other way to get rear wheel drive power and four cylinders in a passenger sedan for the money.,