Fires

[LG17]

Hope all AFF members and their families are safe and well.

[wrongwaynorris]

The one in Springwood jumped the Nepean late yesterday afternoon and we had a few sleepless hours and spent half the night on the roof hose in hand

[mik]

Yes hopefully everyone comes through it safe and well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rycEqiV_IQA

[The Yeti]

Glad you guys came away un harmed wrongwaynorris


Ive taken this from the RFS website

If you Stay and Defend

Before you decide to Stay and Defend, you should ask yourself if you are prepared and capable. If not, you should leave early.

Before the fire impacts, you need to actively defend your property.

Outside your home
Ensure you drink plenty of water so you do not dehydrate.
Block your downpipes, (a sock full of sand/soil will help) and fill your gutters with water.
Move flammable items such as outdoor furniture, doormats, hanging baskets away from the house.
Gas cylinders should have the valve facing away from the house.
Do not stand on your roof with your hose. In bush fires, often more people are injured by falling from roofs than suffering burns.
Patrol the outside of your home, putting out any embers and spot fires that may start. An ember or spark can reach your home hours before the fire front arrives.
Just before the fire arrives, wet down timber decks and gardens close to the house.
Move any firefighting equipment to a place where it will not get burnt.

http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/dsp_conten...#StayandDefend

here's some other info that may be of use for some

http://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/dsp_content.cfm?cat_id=2727

http: //www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/file_syst...2_79866928.pdf

[xxx000]

well said Yeti

be properly prepared, make the decision to stay or go early (early being very early)

and don't worry about finding and taking your insurance policy docs, they (insurance cos.) can easily look them up via your address if needed

don't be hosing shrubs and lawns just in case

[302 XC]

The biggest issue with non suburbia living is all the debri lying around,many coucils don't allow footpath,road side areas to be kept clear by residents removing it,be that branches,fallen trees ect,which is just stoopid
Back burning in the colder months worked for centuries,but now its a big no no,again lets think about something that worked and didn't kill many,save the livestock and the wild life but at what cost to human life
Common sence and forward planning is what you have to do on acreage,dont think your exempt
This time every year branches are stacked and burnt of when I can or allowed

[xxx000]

we've had major destructive bushfires for many decades, I honestly don't think councils or greenies or anybody else is to blame for what we have now

In the 60's people used to mow their lawn and then go through a ritual of burning off the clippings in the gutter. All that did was create lots of smoke and make them somehow feel good, we have better ways for many things now.

[The Yeti]

The weather is the biggest obstacle with Hazard Reductions in NSW not the Greenies or EPA

There are better ways to dispose of prunings and clippings than flashing them up in the gutter

But actual structured planed and risk assessed hazard reductions are done well and I think at lust report NSW was at arround 95% of their planed HR's for 2013

Yesterday was a desaster for a number of reasons, but the combination of single didget humidity and 35+ temps and high winds ment what may have just been a fire was a fire storm

Those who facebook will be able to see this https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v...type=2&theater its a bit of an eye opener

[Bluepower]

God bless our NSW brothers.

[creative]

stay safe everyone.

if an aff member from the central coast area needs anything, just ask. I work near the lake munmorah fire and have been watching it closely and whilst I am not living in the area, my support in the aftermath is there for those that need it.

[Adamz Ghia]

Looking at all the homes lost makes me wonder why all houses built in the bush don't have to have steel pipes through their roofs and sides of the house so when they come under ember attack or the fire is moving through they can switch them on and soak their houses. You spend hundreds of thousands on the house and land, what's another few grand on a high pressure sprinkler system. You might loose your back shed or what ever but at least your family home will be saved...

[Adamz Ghia]

And to the fire fighters, probably the bravest folk in the country right about now, good luck guys!

[The Yeti]

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

Looking at all the homes lost makes me wonder why all houses built in the bush don't have to have steel pipes through their roofs and sides of the house so when they come under ember attack or the fire is moving through they can switch them on and soak their houses. You spend hundreds of thousands on the house and land, what's another few grand on a high pressure sprinkler system. You might loose your back shed or what ever but at least your family home will be saved...

It's not that simple unfortunately, systems like this are available (I have a system here that I built my self,

To do this it would have to be supplied through a tank and pump system, as mains pressure is one of the first things to go, and was an issue in Springwood so you would need a sizeable tank and pump for it to even be an option the next thing is its not always going to work, it may help save your home but it's not a definite that it will

Things with town planing and building management have changed a lot over resent years and you would find the council of the area would have things such as sprinkler systems and tanks as essential items when building in this area but many of these homes were built along time ago.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

Looking at all the homes lost makes me wonder why all houses built in the bush don't have to have steel pipes through their roofs and sides of the house so when they come under ember attack or the fire is moving through they can switch them on and soak their houses. You spend hundreds of thousands on the house and land, what's another few grand on a high pressure sprinkler system. You might loose your back shed or what ever but at least your family home will be saved...

Yes, in the last 10 years they have done a lot of rezoning of any property that backs onto bushfire prone land.

The problem is, they have gone from one extreme to another. I have seen evidence of developers (with deep pockets??) that have been able to 'bypass' the rules... which really peeves me off as I've been battling my council for several months regarding this very issue.

Landscaping consultants, Bushfire consultants, Fire consultants etc etc etc.

You can self assess your property, which I did and found it to be moderate danger. Sent of the paperwork and they automatically slap 'Flame Zone' without even a sight visit or referring to any of my documentation....

Think of it as the 'May contain traces of nuts' response....

Oh.. Flame zone means my house needs to be specced up to standards that make it very costly and, IMO ridiculously un-necessary in my circumstance.

The fight continues. I'm all for common sense, but when it comes to these sorts of standards you are left with splitting headache and more questions than answers...

I have just cancelled my year 7+8 school camp, was meant to be in the Southern highlands tomorrow-Wed. Better safe than sorry!

Hope this blows over soon and anyone who has lost everything can start getting their life back together.

[BAWITHLOT]

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

Looking at all the homes lost makes me wonder why all houses built in the bush don't have to have steel pipes through their roofs and sides of the house so when they come under ember attack or the fire is moving through they can switch them on and soak their houses. You spend hundreds of thousands on the house and land, what's another few grand on a high pressure sprinkler system. You might loose your back shed or what ever but at least your family home will be saved...

Hmmmm you sound like a city folk :-P

I have seen a few systems over the years as YES a few houses up here have them. The main issues are you need a tank and a petrol/ diesel pump as house water pressure soon becomes a trickle when you have a heap of trucks and hoses connected to the hydrants!

Fortunately these things don't happen very often (7-10 years) and all the equipment has to be regularly serviced etc to work when needed (and water in the tank!!!). Us mountain people like yourselves in the city can become very time poor trying to keep a roof over our families heads (only the essentials then get done)!

My thanks goes out to all the Fire Fighters that have done a great job up here as the main parts have been saved by their great efforts

Lets hope that the rain comes and the wind and temperature drops before we loose anything else!!!!!!!

[Adamz Ghia]

Originally Posted by BAWITHLOT

Hmmmm you sound like a city folk :-P

Hahaha you got me!

Wonder if the kids were malicious or just simple kids curiosity getting out of control...?

[chamb0]

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

Looking at all the homes lost makes me wonder why all houses built in the bush don't have to have steel pipes through their roofs and sides of the house so when they come under ember attack or the fire is moving through they can switch them on and soak their houses. You spend hundreds of thousands on the house and land, what's another few grand on a high pressure sprinkler system. You might loose your back shed or what ever but at least your family home will be saved...

It wont always help. From experience (2009 fires), if the fire weather is severe enough it's possible for the wind to shatter the windows, and the embers gain entry directly into the house. Exposed parts of the system can also melt in the radiant heat.

[mik]

Do they know how these fires started ?

[The Yeti]

Originally Posted by mik

Do they know how these fires started ?

The spring wood ones its believed started by a tree falling on power lines and the wind took it from there

[cobramania]

Originally Posted by mik

Do they know how these fires started ?

The Port Stephens one (Heatherbrae) is believed to be from power lines arcing together in the winds, it actually started 5-6 days before & had been under control of the RFS, due to the conditions on Thursday it got away from them (again).

The Wyong/Lake Macquarie fire is believed to have come from a Coal seam close to the surface burning, it had started about 6 weeks before, but had been under control of the RFS flaring up occasionally, again due to the conditions on Thursday it got away from them.

[cobramania]

Originally Posted by cobramania

The Port Stephens one (Heatherbrae) is believed to be from power lines arcing together in the winds, it actually started 5-6 days before & had been under control of the RFS, due to the conditions on Thursday it got away from them (again).

Heard on the news on the way home from work, an 11 year old boy has been arrested & refused bail for starting this fire & another one (Port Stephens - Heatherbrae & Salt Ash). Properties were lost at Salt Ash. Heatherbrae is still going & has currently burnt out over 5000 ha.

[cobramania]

Originally Posted by cobramania

Heard on the news on the way home from work, an 11 year old boy has been arrested & refused bail for starting this fire & another one (Port Stephens - Heatherbrae & Salt Ash). Properties were lost at Salt Ash. Heatherbrae is still going & has currently burnt out over 5000 ha.

Just confirmed, the Salt Ash Fire was power lines arcing, Heatherbrae & Raymond Terrace was 11 year old boy.

[mik]

Originally Posted by cobramania

Heard on the news on the way home from work, an 11 year old boy has been arrested & refused bail for starting this fire & another one (Port Stephens - Heatherbrae & Salt Ash). Properties were lost at Salt Ash. Heatherbrae is still going & has currently burnt out over 5000 ha.

That would be very upsetting for those that lost family or property, I Don't know what it is for people with enough age that should know right from wrong to light fires purposely,
when they must have some inkling people could be hurt or even worse, I can understand a bit of the fascination with fire itself for the very young, when I was a 4 year old dear old ma came out at one stage to see some newspaper in a nice little bonfire on the kitchen floor .......... she put it out not to much harm done except for burnt lino, and prior to that I had been putting lit matches into a full 20 lt drum of kerosene to see what would happen(it didn't ignite), it was used for the old kero heater, I was too young to know any better(but very curious as a lad), but a nice tanned bum saw an end to those flaming experiments.

Anyway, best wishes to those in the danger areas and a hip hip for our fireys/emergency services,and volunteer workers.

[LG17]

Originally Posted by mik

That would be very upsetting for those that lost family or property, I Don't know what it is for people with enough age that should know right from wrong to light fires purposely,
when they must have some inkling people could be hurt or even worse, I can understand a bit of the fascination with fire itself for the very young, when I was a 4 year old dear old ma came out at one stage to see some newspaper in a nice little bonfire on the kitchen floor .......... she put it out not to much harm done except for burnt lino, and prior to that I had been putting lit matches into a full 20 lt drum of kerosene to see what would happen(it didn't ignite), it was used for the old kero heater, I was too young to know any better(but very curious as a lad), but a nice tanned bum saw an end to those flaming experiments.

Anyway, best wishes to those in the danger areas and a hip hip for our fireys/emergency services,and volunteer workers.

4 is a bit different to 11 though Mik.
An 11yo knows!

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by mik

That would be very upsetting for those that lost family or property, I Don't know what it is for people with enough age that should know right from wrong to light fires purposely,
when they must have some inkling people could be hurt or even worse, I can understand a bit of the fascination with fire itself for the very young, when I was a 4 year old dear old ma came out at one stage to see some newspaper in a nice little bonfire on the kitchen floor .......... she put it out not to much harm done except for burnt lino, and prior to that I had been putting lit matches into a full 20 lt drum of kerosene to see what would happen(it didn't ignite), it was used for the old kero heater, I was too young to know any better(but very curious as a lad), but a nice tanned bum saw an end to those flaming experiments.

Apparently when leaving court or where ever he was this kid was flipping off everyone and laughing. His dad was doing the same thing. Obviously his family doesn't care much about what he had done.

[Neale]

Originally Posted by mik

Do they know how these fires started ?

The ones on Lithgow started on the army firing range, so I think someone will be in bit of trouble from that one.

[my_gxl]

Originally Posted by Neale

The ones on Lithgow started on the army firing range, so I think someone will be in bit of trouble from that one.

No worse than people throwing cigarette butts. That's just as bad as others deliberately lighting them.
It also doesn't help when similar lowlifes dump rubbish in the bush.

I flew to Newcastle last Monday, then drove back up. It was fairly smoky then.....

Stay safe.

[castellan]

Originally Posted by my_gxl

No worse than people throwing cigarette butts. That's just as bad as others deliberately lighting them.
It also doesn't help when similar lowlifes dump rubbish in the bush.

I flew to Newcastle last Monday, then drove back up. It was fairly smoky then.....

Stay safe.

Yes good old QLD every idiot just drive along and just tosses their cigarettes out the window without any regard at all.
And cars not don't have anything to stub them out with now do they.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by castellan

Yes good old QLD every idiot just drive along and just tosses their cigarettes out the window without any regard at all.
And cars not don't have anything to stub them out with now do they.

While it isn't an excuse, that is an interesting point. I noticed that a ciggy lighter and ash tray are now optional extras on the new Mirage I put a deposit down on.

An old backpackers trick was to use film canisters to store your butts while off the beaten track, even they are now obsolete!

[Yellow_Festiva]

It makes me sick to think that in many cases human stupidity could be to blame for these fires.... We can't burn off, we need report after report, going through several levels of bureaucracy to justify the removal of dangerous trees, yet people can get an 'exception' to let off fireworks during a total fire ban and electricity companies seeing issues and 'acting' by sending out letters....

I would call the whole system a joke, but the meaning of joke is something funny isn't it?

When will anyone ever learn?????